# Cooling - Fans and temps



## wizzbone (Jan 16, 2008)

HI guys,

as can be seen elsewhere, I am not quite a newbie but relatively close to it! 

allright, I have different questions all related to the title above.
I live in tropical north Queensland (winter 25 summer 35 Celsius)

What is the ideal temp range (in Celsius) for 
CPU (amd 4200) 35-55 - 1.38v
HDD (Maxtor 350) 37-42
1 Video card (Nvidia 7900)hovering around 50 (is a bit hot right?)
other video card has no reading
Mobo (ASUS Crosshair) 35-45

The temperature after the item above is currently the temp in my system according to 'speedfan'

AI NOS booster is currently automatically organising the over clocking

I have five (80mm) fans in my (perspex) case and a standard black CPU fan.

Yesterday I turned my front fan around (to suck air in) and the two side fans ditto. The CPU temp dropped about 5 degrees, the HDD about 3 degrees! (so three fans sucking and 2 blowing would create positive pressure - see other thread elsewhere) :grin:

The CPU fan (3500rpm about) and the front fan (1500-1700rpm) are regulated by the MOBO the others not (yet)

As you might realise this box sitting on my desk, makes a racket like an airplane! (slight exageration) :4-thatsba

*My goal is to make it as quiet as possible*! :grin:

the front fan I had to replace and the new fan did have the 3 pin to connect to the mobo. the other four dont have these. My supplier is looking around for me to get a connector so I can connect these also to the motherboard. 

I hope that this will stop the fans spinning full speed and hence reduce the noise. A bigger CPU fan is also in the plans

I can set the fans to 'Qfan' or dutyclock mode. My CPU fan and front fan are set to Qfan. The CPU according to CPU temp and the front fan set to mOBO temp.


So after all this info, what advice can you guys give me? Am I on the right track? :smooch:

Again what are the temp ranges I should be concerned about?
If some of the above are a bit hot how to correct it? :4-dontkno

here is a picture of my girlfriend (as my wife calls my computer!) :heartlove

Wizz


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## smz (Mar 12, 2007)

Where to start and excuse me if I missed all the utils you used to gather these temps and rpms. First off, I've learned not to count on the included MB utils for hardware monitoring exact temps. Especially for individual cores. Asus may be different but I know for Gigabyte and Abit, this applies. A great couple of freeware utils are CoreTemp and HWmonitor. both Googlable and reputable.

Nice thing about HWmonitor is no special toggle is needed for celsius and F. It displays both. It's written by the guy with the famous CPU ID utility and features everything on one screen in real-time. I will give you my reading as a comparison. Note our CPU's are different so take into consideration I run a Intel QUAD CPU though it's voltage is running lower than your Athlon X2.

I will take your quotes and compare them below:

Q) What is the ideal temp range (in Celsius) for 
CPU (amd 4200) 35-55 - 1.38v

Note: My Quad Q6600 is stock 2.4 overclocked to 3.0ghz. Stock Voltage
A) Ideal for idle or load or both?
CPU (Intel Q6600 Quad) 30-40 Idle
CPU (Intel Q6600 Quad) 50-65 Full Load with Prime 95 Torture Test 1
CPU (Intel Q6600 Quad) 50-60 Full Load with Prime 95 Torture Blend

Keep in mind I'm cooling 2 cores Per Say. My HS/Fan is the Zalman 9500. Though in terms of noise. I run an Antec 900 and all fans are set to silent mode so the only time you here a peep, is during a torture test where the Zalman fan actually spins at an audible level.

My Case:









Zalman 9500 LED:









Q) HDD (Maxtor 350) 37-42
A) HDD (Maxtor 300) 23-34 (These are raided but one drive is much hotter than the other for some reason) If I break it down HD0 is 33-36 and HD1 is 22-36 (wide range?)

Q) 1 Video card (Nvidia 7900)hovering around 50 (is a bit hot right?)
A) 1 Video Card (Nvidia 7600GT) 61-65 though I turned off the GPU fan as it's heatsink is quite thick. I do not use my video card under any stress though. I don't play games outside of Freecell.

Q) Mobo (ASUS Crosshair) 35-45
A) Mobo (GigaByte 965G) 30-35 (Based on Gigabyte Easy Tune 5 Program) not 3rd party readings.

Now don't take my reading as the guideline for what yours should be. But keep in mind. My case is Dead Silent. I run a +$100 power supply with 3 12V Rails that is also silent. What some view as a guideline may vary from person to person and perhaps from summer to winter as well. Right now it's Spring so We are seeing 70-80F in Los Angeles. But a nice cool down at night.

I will make one recommendation before I touch anything else you posted.

LOSE the generic 80MM fans. Period. If you are stuck with no other mounting choice, replace them with Antec Tri Speed mode 80mm or 92mm. Non brand case fans are probably not ball bearing and certainly not efficient with high DBA's and lower CFM.

I use nothing but Antec 120mm Tri-Mode fans in all my cases. I ripped out all the RaidMax stock case fans and replaced them with a couple 80mm Antecs and the rest 92mm and the case is silent after the power supply was replaced.

My recommended low cost quality case fan:
80MM Shown:









I don't know what you run as a CPU HS/Fan solution but 3000+ RPM is too much. If money is an issue, You may be able to get away with something like I did in my server, a $29 Cooler Master TX. Nice long Copper based Heatsink with a 92mm fan. Fairly quiet, but keeps my E4500 Overclocked to 3.0ghz @ 30 Celsius average.

Below is the CM TX:









I'm not sure of Speedfan's accuracy but someone else will probably respond to this and put in their 2 cents.

If I powered all 4 of my 120MM fans to high speed in my case and turned of fan control on the Zalman 9500 HS/Fan, I bet my temps would go down and my overclock ability would go up. But I don't' think this is about Overclocking.

Look forward to hearing back from you. You may want to download Hardware Monitor and from the file menu, choose save then upload it with your response. Click here to download.

Take it easy,
SMZ



wizzbone said:


> HI guys,
> 
> as can be seen elsewhere, I am not quite a newbie but relatively close to it!
> 
> ...


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## wizzbone (Jan 16, 2008)

Thanks for your reply! Yes I will follow up with your advice and tell you later what came of it

I also thought 3000+ was tomuch, I have done some research and BIOS snooping...
I changed the CPU fan setting from 4pin to 3 pin and now the fan speed is1500 or so while the CPU is 41 Celsius.

I also found a setting NVIDIA GPU Ex (quick google) decided to put that enable as well...

My supplier has in store and recommend ZALMAN CNPS7700 Multi Socket Heatsink with Silent 120mm blue LED fan, as this will also cool the heatpipes around the cpu. I will do some more research ($$ vs benefit)

I will get some other Fans and tell you how it went.

Thanks again!!

Wizz


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## smz (Mar 12, 2007)

The 4 Pin is generally for your advantage but if the bios and or speedstep isn't enabled properly, the fan control isn't being utilized.

The Zalman is a great solution depending on who you ask. I like it. I use the 9500LED, the 9700 is a bit larger and boasts about 4 degrees cooler than what I get from my 9500. Certainly without a load, you won't even hear it. Now a days CPU fans rely a ton on the heat pipes and heat sinks. Having just a high speed fan and basic heat sink doesn't cut it anymore. Also proper cooling in the case with the correct kind of airflow makes all the difference in the world. My hard drives are cooled quite nicely but the two incoming 120MM fans even at 1200RPM.

If you go with those antecs I posted, there is a 3 speed switch L M H,
go with L across the board unless you notice a severe increase in case temperature. Last thing on the list I don't think you addressed is your PS. Having a POS basic no name power supply will give you dirty unstable power and lots and lots of noise.

Good Luck, glad I could send some suggestions your way.

SMZ




wizzbone said:


> Thanks for your reply! Yes I will follow up with your advice and tell you later what came of it
> 
> I also thought 3000+ was tomuch, I have done some research and BIOS snooping...
> I changed the CPU fan setting from 4pin to 3 pin and now the fan speed is1500 or so while the CPU is 41 Celsius.
> ...


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## Tumbleweed36 (May 14, 2005)

Nice suggestion for the 3 speed fans. That is what I use in my personal case, and they move enough air on the slowest speed that they keep the case cool and quiet.


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## smz (Mar 12, 2007)

I swear by these. I don't know if it was a mistake or the price just dropped. But I saw these 80MM antecs showing up for $5.99 with the 3 speed switch without the annoying LED but @ $5.99 it seemed like a steal. I think the 90MM wasn't much more. The 120MM are all over $10. But take these fans such as the 120MM and install them in the optional places a case like the sonata or 900 have and it's quite a surprise. and yes the low speed offers fair CFM but at no DBA cost. Though my fan on the side of the case I decided to install a Zalman fanmate so when things get a little toasty, I don't have to rip my case apart to get some air flow going but a 120MM @ 2000RPM creates quite a racket but nothing like an 80MM cranked up to the max.




Tumbleweed36 said:


> Nice suggestion for the 3 speed fans. That is what I use in my personal case, and they move enough air on the slowest speed that they keep the case cool and quiet.


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## ShosMeister (Jan 19, 2008)

Been following this thread as it's quite informative for us less educated individuals. The one thing that I can't seem to find though is where you would plug all of these fans in?

I was looking at my motherboard (MSI K9VGM-V) and only found a connector for the CPU fan. I was thinking of getting a couple of 80mm fans as this is an old case and doesn't have any (didn't really need them with the old motherboard/CPU (P3 I believe)). I was going to start with 1 in the front and 1 in the back and see how it worked, but, again, where do I plug them in?


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## smz (Mar 12, 2007)

I will repost the picture from earlier in the thread and explain in layman's terms










You will see these Antec tricool fans have something that many other fans don't have. An option to use smart motherboard headers for power or simple 4 prong molex universal connectors.

If you have a board like my Gigabyte, it's rather disappointing to have only 2 Fan headers of which one is dedicated to the CPU. I have an Antec 900 and clearly with all the fans it supports, this board is not a good fit for this case. I picked up my Second Abit IP35 tonight. I'm through with this Gigabyte. I didn't realize that it was such a poor overclocker and had stability issues even at stock speeds. Then again, I've got my use out of it.

OK, back to the picture above. See the 3 prong connector, obviously that goes on the MB on any smart fan connector "not labeled CPU" typically you'll see sys fan, aux fan, power fan, etc.

But since I read your message clearly, you have to do it the old fashioned way but it isn't a bad thing because these Antecs have the 3 speed switch to cater to your CFM throughput and DBA preference.
So the other power plug on this combo Tricool fan, is the 4 prong universal connector.Sata did away with them but any IDE drive will certainly have them and still with modern power supplies, you should have ample number of 4 prong power connectors.

If you are limited with the 4 prongers, you can keep daisy chaining the Antec Tricools. When you plug the first fan into the power supply via 4 pronger, the opposite side features a male connector that is live. You can continue to daily chain as many as you wish. I will make a strong recommendation that if you are going to chain more than one fan that you do not have it start or terminate of any device but a fan.

Some power supplies like my trio have 4 prong connectors labeled FAN ONLY. it has just a positive and negative going to it so use that sort of jack if you have one.

Hopefully I covered the different things that come up based on an individuals scenario.

Take Care,
SMZ



ShosMeister said:


> Been following this thread as it's quite informative for us less educated individuals. The one thing that I can't seem to find though is where you would plug all of these fans in?
> 
> I was looking at my motherboard (MSI K9VGM-V) and only found a connector for the CPU fan. I was thinking of getting a couple of 80mm fans as this is an old case and doesn't have any (didn't really need them with the old motherboard/CPU (P3 I believe)). I was going to start with 1 in the front and 1 in the back and see how it worked, but, again, where do I plug them in?


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## wizzbone (Jan 16, 2008)

hi guys:

Thanks for all your very informative points guys. ray:

I have a PSU: flexiglow FG 500w-EZ. (perspex read easy without opening the box lol) :tongue:

Another questions: does the 90 mm fit in the 80mm place? I noticed that the whole in the perspex is actually bigger then the 80mm fan!! I just wonder if the screws place of the 80mm are the same spot as the 90mm...

I downloaded HW Monitor and what Ilike is they give the min and max plus temp for both GPUs... It is now mid day and these are the temps:

CPU: 44-51 fan speed 1854-2481
system (mobo (crosshair)?) 39-40 front fan speed1584 - 1650

ACPI 40

AMD K8
Core 0 42-51
core 1 36-48

GeForce 9700GS 58-59
GeForse 9700GS 49-50

HDD 37

according to PC Probe II (came with mohter board ):

Fan speed 5 (= fan that cools the copperpipes on the motherboard) 3000

For me it seems that this fan is quite fast and the first videocard is quite hot...

What do you think? I am just surfing and wordprocessing. room temp is 30 Celsius

Wizz


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## wizzbone (Jan 16, 2008)

G'day Friends,

OK, let me tell you some findings of my research 

This article was very very interesting:
http://www.overclockers.com.au/wiki/Quiet_PC

It shows that often not only the fan bat also the case and everything else vibrating creates noise. So the fan might be reasonably quiet, but the case acting like an amplifier creates a racket! The solution, rubber/plastic between the fan and the case; also use plastic grommets instead of the metal screws.

some info on these items are here:
http://www.pccasegear.com/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=40


In my research people often advice ball-bearings as better then sleeve-bearings. Interestingly this article disputes this!
http://www.comairrotron.com/cooling_fan_noise.shtml

So for those that are interested in making their case very very quiet. This is very good reading!

I also found some very very quiet and some very groovy fans and PC coolers. I also considered fan-controllers but I wanted to utilise the items available with my mobo. this had fan-controlling capabilities, so why should I do it manually... However here are some nice ones for whoever is interested:

http://www.pccasegear.com/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=9_511

the one I really like:
http://www.pccasegear.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=9_511&products_id=4249
or
http://www.pccasegear.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=9_511&products_id=6849



My research had the following criteria:
1 price,
2 availability (no good looking at stuff in Finland, that is unavailable here!)
3 look good. I wanted all fans to be clear (black fan in a clear case looks ugly) and blue led lights. currently I feel my comp looks like a Christmas tree with all these different lights....

OK. however, eventually loyalty to my comp-shop won over all my research lol...

MY first choice:
CPU cooler:
Thermalright Extreme Ultra 120 kamikaze
thermaltake iFlash 120 mm fan with changing colours!

Second choice
Zalman 9500

However, Laurie (Comp Shop) suggested the Thermaltake BigType VX cooler as that one was very easy to connect to the mobo and very quiet. It did not have a light, but with 5 blue fans and a little blue 3 led light aimed at my the VP it wasn't necessary...

My choice on 80mm fans.
this was harder, because all the very quiet fans were not clear.

So I settled for the antec with the 3 speed setting that Laurie had in stock (did not want to wait!)

the front one I had replaced earlier with an antec without the speed settings. This one had a 3 pin, where the power is also taken from the mobo. (red/black/white all connected to the mobo)

However this antec 3 speed has only the white going to the mobo and I still needed a molex connection (I was hoping to needing less -ugly- wiring) 

That point was disappointing but the case is now very quiet.

The CPU cooler is running on about 500-700rpm.
All the case fans at a bit less then 1500rpm. The front case is the quietest sometimes going below 1200rpm.

I cannot test the computer under load, because it is winter here, hence the temp in the room is between 20-25....

I might still consider to use these items:
http://www.pccasegear.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=40&products_id=6167

http://www.pccasegear.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=40&products_id=882
I like the idea of using these dampeners. They are clear, and might make it again a little quieter.

stainless mesh filter (keep dust out)
http://www.pccasegear.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=207_9_38&products_id=1948

for a little extra I like to put an iflash 80mm at the front of my computer:
http://www.pccasegear.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=9_52&products_id=3772

So I hope that all my research was interesting, and useful to some of you!

Photo comment:
multicoloured fans = (before changes)
After changes
total view



Wizz


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## Doby (Jan 17, 2006)

Very informative post wizzbone thanks for that.



> I also found some very very quiet and some very groovy fans and PC coolers. I also considered fan-controllers but I wanted to utilise the items available with my mobo. this had fan-controlling capabilities, so why should I do it manually... However here are some nice ones for whoever is interested:


I prefer manually just because you are not powering all the case fans through the motherboard but directly off the psu and controll them with a controller or use those great antec 3 speed fans. Weather this is a big deal or not is up for debate but I perfer it that way, thats just me.



> OK. however, eventually loyalty to my comp-shop won over all my research lol...


Thats good to here, when you find a good local shop that you trust talk to these guys they can take very good care of you


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## smz (Mar 12, 2007)

I'm impressed Wizzbone!

That's a better research job than I normally do. Good Going!

I am going to have to bookmark this thread and go through those links when I have some free time. Since My #1 thing for the last 6 months is to make the ultimate silent case but not sacrifice power. My two main sources of silence is an Antec 900 and Antec Sonata II.

If it counts, I'm using an Acer Aspire 5100 laptop base shell with a Turion 2.0ghz CPU to run one application at my place. It's so efficient, the fan never even comes on. The sounds of silence is amazing!

SMZ



wizzbone said:


> G'day Friends,
> 
> OK, let me tell you some findings of my research
> 
> ...


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## wizzbone (Jan 16, 2008)

Thanks SMZ for your comments!

Yeah, when I was a teacher's Aid at the local high school they called me Mr Nerd!

I like researching things until the 2 degree (lol)

At the moment the filter pump of my aquarium makes more noise then my computer, which is a nice guide. I want to get these things mentioned, but my missus (excellent money manager) says that I have spend enough on the comp... So wait for when I can ask for a treat LOL

Wizz


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