# Wired power to my shed :)



## wolfen1086 (Oct 4, 2007)

A couple of years ago the temp wire I had running to my shed rotted away and tripped the breaker, well, last week I started rewiring it, got 75' of underground conduit and a 75' roll of 10-2 grounded, dug me a trench and buried it. Wired my two switches up, one controls the shed lights, one controls the power outlets, well , we used it for the first time today with my Century Powermate 70 wire fed welder, and all the lights on, radio on and everything, so far so good, no breaker trips, no lights in the house or shed dimming , nothing


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## GZ (Jan 31, 2010)

Sweet. Good. Had a bare wire at an old house. (aluminum siding) found it one day when it was icy, slipped and caught hold of the house for support and got zapped good...

That feeding a panel?

If you get a chance, drop a ground rod within 10' of the panel and tie it into the neutral leg. Just some added protection.

I am still waiting for my friend Keith to dig the trench for the 8-3 he has running 200' from his house to his garage. Feeding a 100A sub-panel from a 100A 220V switch, we have 7 fluorescent fixtures, 8 outlets and 2 air compressors (100Gal 2-Stage and 50Gal single stage), Lincoln Electric wire-feed welder, Snap-on scissor-lift and a Blue-Point plasma cutter... The only problem is, the wire is laid out across the lawn... he was supposed to rent the trencher last year and never did. I am still trying to convince him to pick up some PVC conduit, but he won't listen to me.


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## Basementgeek (Feb 7, 2005)

Sounds like fun ! As long as you are up to local code, you will be fine I guess.

BG


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## wolfen1086 (Oct 4, 2007)

Yep got a ground rod, an old well pipe 30' down  Got a 4 breaker panel on the wall capable of 220 but only 110 breakers in there right now, till I rewire it again for a 220 circuit. got lights off one breaker and outlets off another, its not code, its actually above code


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## GZ (Jan 31, 2010)

That is the way I like to do it!


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## Tumbleweed36 (May 14, 2005)

I always do them above code. I have been doing wiring for years and picked up most of my knowledge from my father who was very skilled in that area. 

I have now done the complete wiring (yes, all above code) for three new houses that I built myself, plus some remodelling and rewiring on a few others. Two of those new houses had all electric baseboard heat, and I found that quite easy to do. Makes one feel good to complete a job like that and it works perfectly and when inspected is up to or above code in all areas. However, lots of work.

BTW, when wiring outside buildings or workshops, always used conduit for all of those, just feel safer doing that so someone doesn't get risky with a shovel. Might be worth the extra money and work to do that.


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## GZ (Jan 31, 2010)

Tumbleweed36 said:


> BTW, when wiring outside buildings or workshops, always used conduit for all of those, just feel safer doing that so someone doesn't get risky with a shovel. Might be worth the extra money and work to do that.


Amen to that.


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## SABL (Jul 4, 2008)

You guys are scaring me.

220V on a 2 wire w/ground.....possible but not advised.
100 amps on 8AWG......capacity has been exceded by 54A. Make sure the main feed (in the house panel) is protected with a 40A breaker. You can run any size panel at the destination but need to protect the wire from the source with the proper breaker size. You can also install a sub-panel w/o a main as long as the breaker at the supply does not exceed the capacity of the conductor.....the supply breaker will act as a main. 

As for Wolfen....if you anticipated implementing 220V in your shed you should have gone 10/3 with ground and not exceed 30A for the supply breaker. Cut back now and pay later..........


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## wolfen1086 (Oct 4, 2007)

SABL said:


> You guys are scaring me.
> 
> 220V on a 2 wire w/ground.....possible but not advised.
> 100 amps on 8AWG......capacity has been exceded by 54A. Make sure the main feed (in the house panel) is protected with a 40A breaker. You can run any size panel at the destination but need to protect the wire from the source with the proper breaker size. You can also install a sub-panel w/o a main as long as the breaker at the supply does not exceed the capacity of the conductor.....the supply breaker will act as a main.
> ...


If I redo it and make it 220 it WILL be three wire probably 10 or 8 ga, with ground. which means I'd have a bundle of 10 or 8 ga with a red, white, green, and ground. In the main breaker box in the house I'd use a double 30 double throw breaker for the outlets and keep my current wiring for the lights. And they would be in separates trenches in separate conduit and I'd remap my wiring to show where the new one is.


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## SABL (Jul 4, 2008)

No need for a new trench and conduit if the conduit is large enough.....only need separation from low voltage and higher voltages. Don't make a mess of the situation.......just attach a pull cord to the existing wires in the conduit and retract the conductors, pulling the cord with them. Attach the new wires to the cord and re-pull the circuit......color makes no difference for the "hot" wires (both hot wires can be the same color) but standard is white for neutral and green for ground. Sounds like you are planning on pulling THHN or THWN which can be purchased by the foot at most hardware stores.....or use your city ID and go to an electrical supplier.....that's better.....:grin:. You should get a good discount if you go to a supplier the city buys supplies from. Replace the subpanel in the shed with the larger (and newer) subpanel....or replace the main with a larger capacity breaker if you have sufficient plug-ins for the number of circuits needed. Duplex breakers are available if you are short on 1 or 2 slots. All receptacles should be GFCI protected.....either by breaker or the first receptacle in each circuit.


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## wolfen1086 (Oct 4, 2007)

Yea I thought of that all night last night but right now I can't even think of a reason to wire 220 in the shed, my welder requires a 15 amp breaker, and 12/2 wiring so I'm good there, everything else is 110, and after welding on my jeep the other day I don;t need a bigger welder at all


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## Tumbleweed36 (May 14, 2005)

Bottom line in these type situaitons....be prepared, go bigger if possible, things do change in the future and it is best to be prepared with a bigger line.


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## wolfen1086 (Oct 4, 2007)

^^^^^^^^^^

That is VERY true
Hence why even if I do or don't rewire the thing this year or next year, I have the parts list I'll need, wire size, and box requirements in notepad on the computer along with the route the conduit will take if I do do it.


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## GZ (Jan 31, 2010)

I just finished up a wiring/lighting job today. My pal's garage again. Forced to run lighting with 12/3 (waste if you ask me) because he didn't want to spend the money on 14/3. I did convince him to run 14 gauge stranded through the conduit though.


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## Stedman (Jun 4, 2006)

I disagree with the decision to run cable inside of conduit. Its wasteful as far as your conduit capacity goes. It's often debated whether or not theres anything in the NEC that prohibits people from running NM cable inside of an additional conduit. I've never seen anything definitive one way or another but I'll never be in a position where i'll run 1/2" EMT inside of 1" Rigid conduit and I'll also never put a jacketed cable inside of any kind of conduit unless its a short piece and the hard conduit is used to protect it through penetrations or high damage risk places. Basically the jacket thats on the outside of the individual insulated wires already is a form of conduit so I disagree with running it inside of another type. That added to the fact that buying individual wires and running exactly what you need to where you need it is much less expensive and more versatile than running color/size restricted NM cable to everything.


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## speedster123 (Oct 18, 2006)

i am still trying to get a handle whether an old rusty galvanized well pipe is suitable for a ground. i dont believe it would pass code. I would get a legitimate ground rod.


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## Tumbleweed36 (May 14, 2005)

speedster123 said:


> i am still trying to get a handle whether an old rusty galvanized well pipe is suitable for a ground. i dont believe it would pass code. I would get a legitimate ground rod.


While it may very well work, it is not worth the risk and probably won't pass code....your best bet is the regular ground rod. The local code here in this city now requires two ground rods (several inches apart) for any electrical ground at the main box. That makes no sense to me, but that is the code in this city.


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## wolfen1086 (Oct 4, 2007)

Stedman said:


> I disagree with the decision to run cable inside of conduit. Its wasteful as far as your conduit capacity goes. It's often debated whether or not theres anything in the NEC that prohibits people from running NM cable inside of an additional conduit. I've never seen anything definitive one way or another but I'll never be in a position where i'll run 1/2" EMT inside of 1" Rigid conduit and I'll also never put a jacketed cable inside of any kind of conduit unless its a short piece and the hard conduit is used to protect it through penetrations or high damage risk places. Basically the jacket thats on the outside of the individual insulated wires already is a form of conduit so I disagree with running it inside of another type. That added to the fact that buying individual wires and running exactly what you need to where you need it is much less expensive and more versatile than running color/size restricted NM cable to everything.


I use conduit for the simple reason the last electrical wire I had supplying power to my shed was outdoor bury-able jacketed cable, it was underground so the yard could be mowed and the jacket degraded, allowing water to corrode the copper wires to the point they shorted out and tripped the breaker. I have the same wire in front of my house in underground conduit and after 17 years it is clean and dry inside, Wet wires vs dry wires, I'll pay for the conduit.


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## Wand3r3r (Sep 17, 2010)

two ground rod code, at least where I live, is 10ft apart. Makes no sense to place two ground rods together since the reason for the 2nd is if the other fails to ground sufficently due to changes in ground moisture.


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## wolfen1086 (Oct 4, 2007)

speedster123 said:


> i am still trying to get a handle whether an old rusty galvanized well pipe is suitable for a ground. i dont believe it would pass code. I would get a legitimate ground rod.


A rusty Galvanized pipe here in Va doesn't pass code, at least not in town, but where I work we can get metal of all types, so all I had to do was look in the scrap metal bin and get a suitable ground rod, 3/4" copper, all I had to do was straighten it out, whoever threw it in there (1) missed the opp to recycle copper and get money for it and (2) gave me a 3/4" copper ground rod to sink down the the well 
All I had to do was unroll it, which wasn't easy since it was so thick, but a cable puller did the trick, its mostly straight. I wouldn't use a pipe with rust on it anyway cause rust turns into corrosion under ground and eventually eats through the metal making it useless as a ground or for holding anything.


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