# [SOLVED] New Build, Old OS, Many Problems



## JDComputerRepai (May 27, 2011)

My small computer repair business just got off the ground, and we are working to build a computer for a person as a client. We know their old machine was a cob-job Dell that had been remade by another repair shop. We're not sure where the OS came from or what code was used, so re-install is an intimidating option.

The motherboard is ancient and doesn't even have PCI Express slots in it. The graphics card fit into what looks like it's labeled AGP. So there's no hope of using it in the new machine at all [not that we would!]

It is also worth mentioning that, when this system is booted, unless all the peripherals are installed, the BIOS gets whiny and won't start the machine.

We're trying to start this build with all new components BUT the HDD. The HDD has windows XP on it, and the client really wants to keep the OS she had. When I pop everything into the new set-up, it won't display anything. It sounds like the HDD is active, and the OS seems to start up, but nothing displays through VGA or DVI.

Components List:
ASUS EAH5570 graphics card
MSI 870-G45 Mobo
AMD Phenom II Black [3.2GHz Dual Xore; 7MB cache]

It is again, also worth mentioning that when booting up from a drive without an OS and another drive WITH an OS, nothing displays. I attempted to install the drivers for the ew graphics card through piecing the old machine back together and it blue-screened. >_<

I'm at the end of my rope and my wits. Any ideas would be IMMENSELY appreciated.

Jake


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## sobeit (Nov 11, 2007)

*Re: New Build, Old OS, Many Problems*

first of all, if the operating system is oem, it cannot stay with that computer. it will have to be replaced. Also if you are replacing everything, you will need to use a legal os for that computer and do a repair install if you want to keep everything on the drive. 

clarification - when you say nothing displays, do you mean nothing at all - not even post???


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## GZ (Jan 31, 2010)

*Re: New Build, Old OS, Many Problems*

The driver differences will make it so the OS cannot be saved. You will BSOD unless you install the OS fresh. Most likely the HAL is completely incompatible as well. 

Also, that OS can only be used if it is a full retail version of XP.

Also, check with MSI to see if they have XP drivers for the new board, with the advent of Windows 7, manufacturers have slowly been dropping XP support.


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## emosun (Oct 4, 2006)

*Re: New Build, Old OS, Many Problems*



JDComputerRepai said:


> It is also worth mentioning that, when this system is booted, unless all the peripherals are installed, the BIOS gets whiny and won't start the machine.


This is pretty consistent with , well , all computers...



JDComputerRepai said:


> It is again, also worth mentioning that when booting up from a drive without an OS and another drive WITH an OS, nothing displays.


You cannot just simply move drives around different machines and expect them to boot an operating system that isn't configured for that pc. This is why you reinstall the os , which by he way takes only an hour , sometimes not even.


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## Tyree (May 10, 2009)

*Re: New Build, Old OS, Many Problems*

XP drivers for that Mobo are available. As stated above, you will need a retail version of an OS. What RAM & PSU are you using for the customer?


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## JDComputerRepai (May 27, 2011)

*Re: New Build, Old OS, Many Problems*

Thank you guys for all the help. I realize it causes issues to try to do what we're doing, but I just wanted to know if there was a way to do so. Many thanks!


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## emosun (Oct 4, 2006)

*Re: New Build, Old OS, Many Problems*

Back in the windows 98 days , you could move OS drives between machine without them needing to be reinstalled.

But todays operating systems are far more complex , the first thing the os will try to load is the chipset driver and when it realizes the machine doesn't have the correct chipset it'll bluescreen and reboot.

You most logical option is to save any important documents (pictures music) off that drive and reinstall it's OS.


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## djaburg (May 15, 2008)

*Re: New Build, Old OS, Many Problems*

Unfortunately it sounds like you may have chosen the most difficult route to upgrade the computer. Realizing that customer expectations are often unrealistic, I usually will recommend purchasing a new computer and migrating the user data to it. I usually try to determine what the client wants to keep the OS for and it seems to always be one of two reasons, applications they no longer have disks for or they don't want to change to a new OS for fear of learning everything over again. If I have a client that insists on having the same OS installed on the new computer, I usually verify what kind of OS (oem or retail) they have and then make my recommendations from there. Clients usually do respond well when you tell them the cost difference between tediously upgrading hardware and OS to facilitate their wishes, versus new computer and data migration.

Make sure you ghost the HD should anything go wrong during the process.


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## JDComputerRepai (May 27, 2011)

*Re: New Build, Old OS, Many Problems*

Something interesting to mention: Bought a new Caviar Blue HDD and installed in the machine. Powering on the system lights everything, and everything seems to have power, and the Motherboard shows CPU power, but nothing is displaying. Wondering if there is a processor issue. Any ideas?


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## sobeit (Nov 11, 2007)

*Re: New Build, Old OS, Many Problems*

nothing displaying??? not even post. maybe you knocked something loose while installing the drive - if onboard video recheck the ram.


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## JDComputerRepai (May 27, 2011)

There's no on board video, which I think would fix all of our problems. But then, how do drives work without onboard graphics? Obviously they do because they sell them. Literally, no matter what HDD we put in, Graphics card we put in, and output we choose, the monitor is picking up nothing from any of them. Nothing is displaying, not even post, sobeit. I'm losing heart due to this project, it's so annoying...

I apologize for double posting, but we've been working on this machine tonight and we've come up with a few things the problem is NOT.

The memory works in another computer
The processor works in another computer
The graphics card works in another computer
The HDD works in another computer

The only thing we can think is one of the following:

The motherboard is faulty [too late to return, so we're taking a loss]
The power supply is not powering the board correctly.


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## emosun (Oct 4, 2006)

*Re: New Build, Old OS, Many Problems*

Can you link the exact cpu you bought? That board seems to not support certain revisions of the phenom II x2.


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## JDComputerRepai (May 27, 2011)

*Re: New Build, Old OS, Many Problems*

Here it is:
Newegg.com - MSI 870-G45 AM3 AMD 770 ATX AMD Motherboard


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## emosun (Oct 4, 2006)

*Re: New Build, Old OS, Many Problems*

I'd need to know the cpu specifically not really the board.


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## JDComputerRepai (May 27, 2011)

*Re: New Build, Old OS, Many Problems*

Oops... Misread your question. I'll post the CPU as soon as I go to the shop tomorrow.


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## dai (Jul 2, 2004)

*Re: New Build, Old OS, Many Problems*

psu
brand
model
wattage


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## JDComputerRepai (May 27, 2011)

*Re: New Build, Old OS, Many Problems*

@emosun - AMD Phenom II X2 555 Black Edition 3.2 GHz Socket AM3 80W
Newegg.com - AMD Phenom II X2 555 Black Edition Callisto 3.2GHz 2 x 512KB L2 Cache 6MB L3 Cache Socket AM3 80W Dual-Core Desktop Processor - C3 Revision HDZ555WFGMBOX

@dai - The PSU came with the case I bought, but I'll provide a link to that.

Case - Newegg.com - COOLER MASTER Elite RC-310-OWR460 Black SECC ATX Mid Tower Computer Case RS-460-PSAR-J3, Elite 460W Power Supply

It says in the specs the power supply is a RS-460-PSAR-J3, Elite 460W, assuming it's made by cooler master.


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## gcavan (Aug 13, 2009)

*Re: New Build, Old OS, Many Problems*

The power supply is a piece of crud, but it should be sufficient to boot your computer. I suggest you take a couple steps back and start over with a Bench Test. 

Try to boot with only motherboard, CPU, video and one stick of memory. If you get display and can access system BIOS, then that much is probably OK. Power off, add another component and try again. Rinse and repeat until the system is up and running or you have identified a bad component.

If the system does not boot with the minimum components installed, one of those is failed. Probably the motherboard as the video, CPU and ram has tested ok.

PS: If the motherboard is new (as stated in post 1) why can it not be returned?


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## JDComputerRepai (May 27, 2011)

*Re: New Build, Old OS, Many Problems*

gcavan, the site I purchased from has a 30-day return policy, so I can't pawn it off on them. I have contacted the manufacturer in hopes to return the board for a replacement. 

We started with a bench test after the build wouldn't show anything including post. Then we started doing anything we could think of to figure out what the problem was. 

I kinda figured the PSU wasn't the greatest, but it seemed sufficient to power the build and it was affordable for the client.


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## Tyree (May 10, 2009)

*Re: New Build, Old OS, Many Problems*

The RS-460-PSAR-J3, Elite 460W is in reality a 400W PSU and a very poor quality one. It is certainly not sufficient for a 5570 GPU.
If you intend to stay in the PC repair business I would suggest you offer better quality parts to your customers. 
http://www.techsupportforum.com/forums/f210/power-supply-information-and-selection-192217.html


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## JDComputerRepai (May 27, 2011)

*Re: New Build, Old OS, Many Problems*

Thanks for the info. Although how can a company state a PSU is 460W when it's 400W


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## dai (Jul 2, 2004)

*Re: New Build, Old OS, Many Problems*

it's a play on figures

some state the peak output for the wattage although it may only be capable of sustaining it for less than 30 sec

the actual output depends on the efficiency rating of the unit

i.e. [email protected] 66% effic=actual 300w

todays computers require 80+ rating and this rating listed is being rorted that's why we recommend only the top brands and models


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## JDComputerRepai (May 27, 2011)

*Re: New Build, Old OS, Many Problems*

Very good information to have. Thanks, dai. It is greatly appreciated. So back to the original thread: Do you think the PSU is the problem? We have several others we can swap in to test it out, I just seriously overlooked that vital piece of info.

Being fledgling means we're constantly learning new things, and this is one we'll take back home with us.


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## dai (Jul 2, 2004)

*Re: New Build, Old OS, Many Problems*

no your psu needs to be up here

Newegg.com - CORSAIR Enthusiast Series TX650 V2 650W ATX12V v2.31/ EPS12V v2.92 80 PLUS BRONZE Certified Active PFC High Performance Power Supply


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## JDComputerRepai (May 27, 2011)

*Re: New Build, Old OS, Many Problems*

So a useful piece of information, er, more like a novel's worth.

Our test base, which we've been running all our tests with, has the following components:
Motherboard: MSI 890FXA
CPU: Phenom II x4 970
GPU: XFX ATI Radeon 5770 [overclocked]
Mem: 8GB Corsair Vengence 2133
HDD: Seagate 120GB 7,200 RPM; WD 500GB 7,200 RPM
1 Disk Drive
3 case fans
Rosewill card reader
Cooler Master HAF 955

This machine can run easily and without strain on the Cooler Master PSU that you guys recommended be changed for the machine with lower components that we are currently building. Are you guys mis-informed? Or am I just happy I've found the problem with this build?


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## Tyree (May 10, 2009)

*Re: New Build, Old OS, Many Problems*

Many of us here build/repair PC's for a living and we are not misinformed. 
The CoolerMaster 460W has the same internal components as the 400W Model. There is no governing body that reigns over PSU makers so they can put any number they want on any PSU they make. 
Poor quality PSU's may run fine for quite some time but you can be assured they are slowly doing damage to other components when they can not supply sufficient clean power to those components. 
The PSU is THE most important component in the system as all other components rely on it to survive.
Always use SeaSonic made PSU's (SeaSonic-XFX-Corsair) for all of your builds. Selling junk will come back to bite you in the butt.


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## JDComputerRepai (May 27, 2011)

*Re: New Build, Old OS, Many Problems*

So all PSU information aside, [and it is well noted and much appreciated, btw] would this be a Mobo problem we are having? I'm all for learning, but right now I want to get this build done. 

We've informed the buyer that she would be wise to replace the PSU immediately, but she wants to keep the component that came with the case.


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## Tyree (May 10, 2009)

*Re: New Build, Old OS, Many Problems*

The PSU that is being used could very well be the base of your issues. The best you can do is inform the customer and let them make the choice. 
If it were in my shop the PSU would be replaced or it would leave exactly as it came.


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## JDComputerRepai (May 27, 2011)

*Re: New Build, Old OS, Many Problems*

If the PSU is the source of the problem, why does it run higher end components fine?

Like I said, we're replacing the motherboard and have informed the buyer of the quality of PSU.


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## dai (Jul 2, 2004)

*Re: New Build, Old OS, Many Problems*

the power requirements depend on what is running

when you boot is usually the highest power draw then the demand drops away until you run something power intensive


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## JDComputerRepai (May 27, 2011)

*Re: New Build, Old OS, Many Problems*

We booted the higher spec machine with the "crappy" PSU, and we ran Prime 95 for ten minutes after we ran a lower spec game [DoW-Dark Crusade] then a higher spec game [Mass Effect] Both on highest graphic settings for at least ten minutes.

I really don't mean to seem like I'm trying to argue with you all, I just want to know what's going on. I'm telling you guys exactly what we've done, and I seriously don't understand how a higher spec machine that can run off the PSU you guys told me would not run the lower spec machine unless it's a motherboard problem and not the PSU at all.

Anyways, if all goes well, we'll get a replacement motherboard and I'll fill you all in on if it solved the problem or not.


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## Wrench97 (May 10, 2008)

*Re: New Build, Old OS, Many Problems*

You should get a post and be able to get into the bios with just the Motherboard, CPU(including heatsink), Video card, Power Supply and Ram on the bench by jumping the PWR_On pins on the front panel header, if you can't go no farther, if it seems like it is starting but not displaying video swap out the video card for a known good one, or test the card in a working PC.


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## Tyree (May 10, 2009)

*Re: New Build, Old OS, Many Problems*

The Mobo could possibly be your issue as MSI ar OK but not top quality.
Our PSU advice is based on our combined experiences of building/repairing PC's.
It is always possible for a underpowered low quality PSU to run components but it will do damage to the components over time.


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## JDComputerRepai (May 27, 2011)

*Re: New Build, Old OS, Many Problems*

@Wrench: Done and done. All components work in other machines
@Tyree: We'll work on getting a replacement PSU for the machine. We have time now that we're waiting to return the board.


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## JDComputerRepai (May 27, 2011)

*Re: New Build, Old OS, Many Problems*

So, the solution to this problem [sorry for being so late in responding, been pretty hectic lately, was that the CD drives from the old Dell were messing up the system, along with a wireless NIC card that was plugged in. Build went off without a hitch with the stuff we have, and we've learned from the future. Thanks to the help from all of you guys!


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## dai (Jul 2, 2004)

glad you have it sorted


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