# Better late than never



## v-six

I've been deliberating about what to write about in lesson #1, and decided I give you all a little homework. :smile: I did it too, I'm not above the law!
First of all, I want to give everyone a disclaimer: I've got a pretty broad background in Graphic Design, so I'll be covering alot of ground over time. Most likely, you will be getting into some subjects that you didn't know you cared about. I won't be talking about much of any image editing in my posts.. _If that's what you're here to learn, let me know so that I'm not wasting everyone's time_. Now then... the homework:
White space, a.k.a. negative space. This is important in design no matter what you're doing. In print, it is crucial. On the web, small changes in spacing make the difference between a great and not-so-great layout. Imagine if everytime you went to a website the body text was set flush with the margin, or if you were reading a book where the words went straight to the edge of the page. There would be no visual buffer, and your poor thumbs would have nowhere to rest. Or maybe there is so much white space on the page that the content looks puny. I want to get everyone thinking consciously about this.
Your homework, if you choose to do it:
Find a quote you like, shouldn't be more than a sentence or two. Typeset it in whatever program you like. If you don't have anything, The GIMP should do. Here's the specifications:
No proprietary filters/effects
Grayscale
No importing images, everything but the quote should be your own.
Background color should be white
Not a standard image size. I.E. not 800 x 600, 1024 x 768, 8.5 in x 11, etc. Don't just pick a random size though, set the final size after you've set the quote, this way you can focus on the white space and how it relates to your content.
If you have any questions, please ask!

Here's mine, feel free to pick at it. If you say awful things about it, then I know you're paying attention.


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## devil lady

Not sure if this is what you had in mind?


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## DumberDrummer

I like this quote, personally. A lot of the tongue in cheek stuff he said after he did all the science.


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## v-six

devil lady said:


> Not sure if this is what you had in mind?


Right on.


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## Chevy

*Well, maybe this will work*

It's 3 am ... Don't know why I'm still up ....


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## v-six

ok, now that we've got a few pieces to look at, I'd like to start talking about them. Anyone that would like to be exempt from having their work talked about, speak now or... well, you know.
There won't be any _this is good, this is bad_, it's just good to have things to use as jumping-off points.
Also, this is a pretty good opportunity to hit on some points in typography, if everyone would prefer not hear it, this is also your time to speak :grin:


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## koala

Three attempts at the same quote.


1... 2 lines, bold typeface, lowercase, aligned to the left, no kerning, Dr Seuss placed in lower right to give a literary look.


2... 4 lines, central alignment, space between lines reduced, punctuation removed, lots of white space. Each line adjusted using horizontal scaling and charcter tracking. Need some advice on how to do this better.


3... Text positioning relates to contents of phrase. Breaks up the flow when reading. Signature moved to bottom left to balance out the black area in top right and complete the triangular shape. Light grey quotation marks blurred, enlarged and positioned slightly outside the viewing area.


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## koala

Some quick comments - 

SixShooter, I like the font you chose for Voltaire, it looks classy and traditional. Good spacing of the letters. The white V on a rectangle works well, I like how it drops below the line. What's it called when they illustrate the first capital on a page, like in bibles and old documents? The dates are difficult to read... maybe a thin black outline or a darker rectangle? The text block is centrally positioned in a large white space... you could experiment with different positions.

Devil Lady, perfect font for romantic poetry. The black text really jumps out from the grey. Should the dates be touching the text above?

Chevy, I like the alignment of the 3 lines, creating a diagonal slant opposite to the direction of Decision. Makes it look dynamic. Good choice of font for the signature.


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## devil lady

I mainly did the dates like that to catch the fact he was only 39 when he died.


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## v-six

Koala, the word that you're looking for is drop caps. They came from illuminated manuscripts, which in medieval times got pretty intricate. In some of the old Celtic manuscripts, the first letter might take up an entire page.

Now for some comments..
Chevy & Devil Lady, try to be careful that your ascenders and descenders (tops & bottoms of letters) aren't touching the line above or below them, as Koala mentioned. If they are touching, make it look intentional. Look at the logo in my signature for an example. Not too many people would question whether the text overlapping was accidental or not. Devil Lady, the movement you put into the numbers is a great choice for the quote and author. I recommend exploring small caps/oldstyle figures for your numerals. They're basically the lower-case equivalent of 1234567890. They should be present in any font with the "Pro" suffix. Be mindful of your kerning, (the space between letters). If you want to change the vertical orientation of a letter without having to move it around manually, you can set the baseline shift in Photoshop. If you want to know how, I'd be happy to elaborate. 
Koala, your second version with 4 lines hit well on the awareness of white space that wanted everyone to be thinking of. Be careful about scaling letters though. It works with your content as there was just cause for scaling the text, but many designers/typographers consider it a "type crime" for various reasons. Consider yourself warned, that's one of the things a typophile might throw punches over :smile:


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## E-Liam

*A late entry*

Hi,

I saw this earlier, but have been too busy today to enter my meagre effort until now. I've tried to get an essence for the quote, ie. repetetiveness without reason, and introduce it into the graphic. 

The quote in all it's glory










Perhaps not original, but I tried to use fonts that expanded on the theme.. The *insanity* font was Milano Ultra Lite, to give a definition to the title, contrasting the theme with the boring text, along with the drop shadow and gaussian blur.. the Monospace Italic for the main text, to attempt to portray, and add to the monotony.. hence the eight lines of half the quote.. and the name/date in a basic italic for 
?authenticity?

I would have liked to have used a touch of dark blue, angled to suit, in the bottom half; just to highlight.. but I wasn't allowed..:grin: 

This was done in GIMP, which I've only had a chance to use for about a month, so if I bring you an apple teacher.. will you be nice. ???????

Nahh, didn't think so. :grin: 

I found the best angle for *insanity* that I could, and I think it works, but the word spacing of the particular quote stopped me from acheiving the original idea of having the *:* on the end perfectly vertical.

God, this looks pretentious when proofing. :grin:

Cheers

Liam


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## Spatcher

Here is something I just did, and I had to do it in the Gimp instead of PSP7, it didn't/I didn't like text adding on it.


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## Chevy

Version 2 ... The idea came to me, so I went with it .... The arrow is multiple / and an arrowhead from the Wingdings font.


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## v-six

Now, for the meaning behind all of this. :smile: 
The big question... If you had to print out your quote on a regular piece of white 8.5 x 11 or 11 x 17 paper, how would you want it to look? You would be allowed to print the quote in any position on the paper, and trim the paper to any size..

You aren't required to post any new files, but give it alittle thought at least. This is actually pretty relevent in the design business. Lets say you just designed the Nike Swoosh and "Just Do It." They want 1,000,000 flyers made with the new logo. No effects, just straight-forward swoosh and the words "Just Do It." They're corporate after all, simple is good. Do you just print it out on a letter size document and send them out? If you want to keep your job, _no!_


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## E-Liam

Hi Six,

just a quick question. Can anything else be added to the page apart from the quote? If no! then I'd print it with the paper trimmed to the height of the image plus 20mm or so, and the width around 2 1/2x that of the image, leaving all the space to the right, except a 20mm margin at the left.

If extras can be added.. an image and extra text for example, then I've got an idea.  

Admittedly, when producing the image I gave no thought whatsover to your new question, which I guess was your point anyways.. :grin:

Next time I will, promise!

I saw this yesterday evening and was stumped.. and still am to eb honest. :grin:

Cheers

Liam


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## v-six

Go nuts.


E-Liam said:


> Hi Six,
> 
> just a quick question. Can anything else be added to the page apart from the quote? If no! then I'd print it with the paper trimmed to the height of the image plus 20mm or so, and the width around 2 1/2x that of the image, leaving all the space to the right, except a 20mm margin at the left.
> 
> If extras can be added.. an image and extra text for example, then I've got an idea.
> 
> Admittedly, when producing the image I gave no thought whatsover to your new question, which I guess was your point anyways.. :grin:
> 
> Next time I will, promise!
> 
> I saw this yesterday evening and was stumped.. and still am to eb honest. :grin:
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Liam


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## E-Liam

Okey-Dokey,

probably sometime tomorrow


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## v-six

Chevy said:


> Version 2 ... The idea came to me, so I went with it .... The arrow is multiple / and an arrowhead from the Wingdings font.


Chevy, try out your all caps words tracked out (letter spaced). You might like it that way, you might not. If you're not sure of how to execute that, let me know.


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## Chevy

SixShooter said:


> Chevy, try out your all caps words tracked out (letter spaced). You might like it that way, you might not. If you're not sure of how to execute that, let me know.



All caps .. ok, got that .... letter spaced? Do you mean ... s p a c e d ... ?


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## v-six

Chevy said:


> All caps .. ok, got that .... letter spaced? Do you mean ... s p a c e d ... ?


Yep. They wouldn't need to be spaced too substantially, they're pretty loose as it is. For general use though, it's good practice to add alittle letter spacing if you're using caps.


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## E-Liam

Hi,

well this is the first go.. it's gone 8pm on Friday night, and I'm sitting in front of a computer rather than a beer.. :grin:










I tried to keep in mind the whitespace issues for the right hand side, and have tried to make it contrastingly spartan compared to the left. I think I've got the various blocks proportioned according to where they are on the page.

Cheers

Liam


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## ebackhus

*On the subject of art...*


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## v-six

E-Liam said:


> I tried to keep in mind the whitespace issues for the right hand side, and have tried to make it contrastingly spartan compared to the left. I think I've got the various blocks proportioned according to where they are on the page.


Just be happy I'm not making you all do a page layout :grin: Here's a chapter from one of my favorite books, The Form of the Book, Essays on the Morality of Good Design
There's a didact if you'll ever see one.


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## E-Liam

Hi Six,

I've just got in from a very convivial meal with a couple of friends of ours. I'll read the link in the morning (1.00am here) but is this a pass or fail???? :4-dontkno :grin: 

Cheers

Liam


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## Chevy

Well .... Made some adjustments .... This is how I would print it ...


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## v-six

E-Liam said:


> Hi Six,
> 
> I've just got in from a very convivial meal with a couple of friends of ours. I'll read the link in the morning (1.00am here) but is this a pass or fail???? :4-dontkno :grin:
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Liam


everyone passes this one


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## Grove

Even Me ? :grin:

Sorry I have had absolutely no time to work on this. I have been too busy with other personal issues. :sayno:


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## koala

My PC has been out of action for a couple of days. I haven't got Photoshop back on yet so I can't post an updated image.

The final composition would depend on what it's going to be used for, so if it was going to be a postcard-sized flyer, I would use shiny black card with white text. Same landscape layout as in my 2nd image, maybe using a blockier font or bold and more tightly spaced. The letters would touch the edges of the card and the signature at the bottom would be in lowercase. The 'white space' in the middle would take up the same amount of room as the text above it.


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## E-Liam

Great link ,

I've read it through once, and will have to do so again at least twice (25 times?!). There's no chance I can take that in in one go. I do like my maths, so that'll help with the layout configs.

Cheers

Liam


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## v-six

I've read the entire book twice, and still have alot to learn from it.


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## v-six

Chevy said:


> Well .... Made some adjustments .... This is how I would print it ...


Chevy, see if you like/dislike this layout with more empty space, especially on the top and bottom. The black arrows hold alot of weight... and anything like that near the edges of a document can make it feel heavy on that side. It's easier to balance it with more of a buffer... kind of like how you can tell the difference between 10 and 20 millimeters immediately, but not so much with 60 and 70. It's all about individual perception, but my eyes see it as bottom-heavy. If anyone agrees/disagrees, i'd like to hear it.
-Six


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## v-six

ebackhus said:


>


Is the word "Creativity" set in papyrus?


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## ebackhus

Yes, yes it is.


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## v-six

Heh, be careful about using that one in anything commercial. An exact quote from a mentor that I think very highly of:
"I've yet to see anyone typeset Papyrus well."
When someone's got their MFA from RISD you tend to listen to what they have to say. :grin:


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## Spatcher

Hey Six, I passed?


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## Chevy

SixShooter said:


> Chevy, see if you like/dislike this layout with more empty space, especially on the top and bottom. The black arrows hold alot of weight... and anything like that near the edges of a document can make it feel heavy on that side. It's easier to balance it with more of a buffer... kind of like how you can tell the difference between 10 and 20 millimeters immediately, but not so much with 60 and 70. It's all about individual perception, but my eyes see it as bottom-heavy. If anyone agrees/disagrees, i'd like to hear it.
> -Six



Makes sense .... Maybe add about 1/2" left and bottom?


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## v-six

Add as much or as little as you want. Play around with different values and see what kind of effect it has.


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## v-six

HenryVI said:


> Hey Six, I passed?


Henry, you passed, even though I'd like to see you do the layout again and further consider the white space. If you want help/guidance on the matter, let me know.


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## v-six

Some of you were almost treading into expressive typography. Something to check out, if you ever have the opportunity, is some of David Carson's work from RayGun magazine. It's incredibly hard to find unfortunately.


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