# Building new comp.



## ajensl (Feb 8, 2008)

Hello all,

Buillding new computer but haven't got that far yet. Haven't purchased anything thus far because I'm too scared something won't be compatible. So all I'm asking is, would someone with more computer knowledge than me (I'm not illiterate, but I haven't dealt with hardware that much.) please let me know if I'm going to run into any issues with these parts:

Mobo: Asus Maximus-Extreme
CPU: Intel Core 2 Duo E6850 3.0Ghz Conroe, 4MB cache. (*** does Conroe mean?)
VGA: Inno3D GeForce 8800GT 512mb PCI-E 2.0 Factory O.C'ed to 650/1900MHz
RAM: Kingston 2 stick of 1Gb @ 800MHz.
HDD: Western Digital 500Gb SATAII w/16mb cache.
Case: Thermaltake Soprano Midi tower case w/ 430w PSU.

I'm 99% sure that it'll all be fine. But the last thing I want to happen is to drop $1700 into a new comp and have it be unstable/not work at all.
Furthermore, is there anything that you guys can suggest that I could do better? Different brand or anything?
I looked around but I couldn't find anything on compatibility between the various parts, so it isn't like I came to you guys without trying myself first! My main worries are:
Will the 430w PSU be reliable?
Will 430w be enough to power all the stuff in there, plus maybe an extra stick of RAM and another monitor IE Dual-screen? The case does run dual 12cm fan in front and rear. But then I guess they wouldn't inc. that PSU with the case if it couldn't do its job.
Kingston RAM on an Asus mobo? My friend said check it out but I couldn't find anything that says it's incompatible, but then you've all probably got more knowledge and better resources.

Anymore information I should provide? Links to parts or something?

Thanks all of you in advance,
AJ


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## emosun (Oct 4, 2006)

Welcome to tsf. For starters , No that psu will most likely be crap. Psu's that come with cases are usually feebee's that are thrown in to sweeten the deal. Even if it was a good psu its still far to underpowered. You will need a quality psu 600w or more for that setup with the 8800. I recommend Antec or thermaltake psu's. 

Also I would go with seagate not western digital as a hard drive brand. Seagates tend to be more reliable and have better warenties.

Also, you didn't post a cpu cooler, for that I would recommend a zalman cooler.


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## themisiek1 (Aug 20, 2007)

Intel Core 2 Duo E6850 3.0Ghz Conroe 4MB cache. Conroe is the "type" of chip it is. The microarchitecture of that CPU is Conroe. I have the legendary E6850 and am 100% happy with it. Never doubted it for 1 second. But there is a new monster on the market.

Intel Core 2 Duo E8400 Wolfdale 3.0GHz 6MB L2 Cache LGA 775 65W Dual-Core Processor
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115037

It is the same chip except a different microarchitecture (Wolfdale). It is cheaper, alittle faster due to the 6MB L2 cache as opposed to the Conroes 4MB cache, less heat, and less power consumption. It is 45nm as apposed to the 65nm Conroe. All that means is it can be overclocked higher due to the fact it takes in less power and heat.

A nm is a nanometer, which is a measurement of length equal to 1×10^−9 m or one billionth of a meter. In processors, it is the measure of the distance between each individual transistor on the processor die. The smaller this number, the less power the processor will take and the less heat it will produce. Every IC from CPUs to GPUs to northbridges have a different transistor distance, or process technology, in nm. No the performance will not go down with a smaller nanometer but instead go up... less power + less heat = much faster clock speeds!!!


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## ajensl (Feb 8, 2008)

Many thanks for the heads up RE: PSU and Wolfdale architecture! That chip is so much more awesome and cheaper!
Drinks all around methinks.

Antec 650w PSU
Intel Core 2 Duo 8400 3.0Ghz (Wolfdale sounds so much better...how pathetically aesthetic.)

Now...cooling. Something that is almost totally foreign to me. I'm looking at something less than $80, but no real idea what's better than what. I don't care about noise so fans are no problem, Zalman stuff looks pretty nifty, but then it might be too big. I've been hearing that the Maximus Extreme is a little cramped for space. Thoughts anyone? Both on what cooler to buy and also regarding it's size? Is there anything I need to worry about like the plug for the fan being incompatible with the motherboard socket? Or have PC's finally manged to agree, universally on something? (And oh look! Hell just freezed over )

Many thanks all


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## themisiek1 (Aug 20, 2007)

When buying a cooling system you need to make sure the fan and heatsink or just heatsink are supported by the socket type. This is a great CPU cooler.

Zalman 9500A
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835118223


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## ajensl (Feb 8, 2008)

Awesome this one of a few i looked at. Descision reached.
Thx peeps.


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## ajensl (Feb 8, 2008)

Gakk double post my bad.
Just checking that all is in order now:

- Intel Core 2 Duo 8400 3.0Ghz Wolfdale 6mb cache

- Asus Maximus Extreme mobo (could I get a better/different Intel socket 775 mobo for same price? ~$550AUD. It supports DDR3 and Quad core, so I decided it would be good if I wanted to upgrade. But I dunno might be something cheaper and better?)

- Inno3D GeForce 8800GT 512mb (Factory OC'ed to 650/1900mhz, still has stock cooler though. Is it possible to replace a stock cooler that covers the whole card?)

- Seagate 500Gb HDD SATAII w/ 32mb cache

- Sweet case: Cooler Master Mystique (Black) http://www.coolermaster.com/products/product.php?language=en&act=detail&tbcate=17&id=43

- Antec 650w PSU

- Zalman 9500 (supports socket 775) CPU fan/heatsink.

In the PSU details I read, it has 4 SATA connectors, that's fine. But the Seagate HDD says it's SATAII, are the connectors different? Or is it just that something like cables/transfer speed are different?

Thanks for all your help so far, you saved me from a rather unhappy, underpowered computer.


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## TheMatt (May 9, 2006)

themisiek1 said:


> Intel Core 2 Duo E6850 3.0Ghz Conroe 4MB cache. Conroe is the "type" of chip it is. The microarchitecture of that CPU is Conroe. I have the legendary E6850 and am 100% happy with it. Never doubted it for 1 second. But there is a new monster on the market.
> 
> Intel Core 2 Duo E8400 Wolfdale 3.0GHz 6MB L2 Cache LGA 775 65W Dual-Core Processor
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115037
> ...


Good explanation. It is also worth noting that Intel lowered the Vcore on the Wolfdale to further reduce power consumption, and that the Wolfdale incorporates Intel's "Hi-K" Halfinium Oxide semiconductors which have a lower switching power leakage than the traditional Silicon Dioxide semiconductors.

From a logical perspective however, the Wolfdale uses the exact same Intel Core architecture as the Conroe.

As for your build, consider two 250GB drives if the price isn't that much higher. More drives are always better. :wink:


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## ajensl (Feb 8, 2008)

More questions...nearly there...

Do connectors for CPU fans vary? IE Do I need to worry about compatibility between the Zalman 9500A and Asus Maximus Extreme mobo?

The Antec PSU comes with "4 SATA connectors" but the Seagate drive is SATAII, are they different things in terms of the connector?

The mobo comes with a SupremeFXII Audio card. Will this card be able to run 5.1 speakers? 
I plan on buying them in the near future so I'll just get a better sound card now if that's the case. I looked on the Asus website at the board, and googled the card but nowhere did it say whether it did or didn't support 5.1. I can't help but think I'm asking a redundant question here...but I'd rather be certain!

Thanks all very much.
AJ


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## emosun (Oct 4, 2006)

The 9500A should plug into that board just fine.

SataII is the actual link to the motherboard not the type of power connector it uses so the psu will fit the drives fine.

And the board comes with a small sound daughter board that supports 5.1


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## MaXXimus (Feb 7, 2008)

Just noticed your trying to use DDR2 memory on a board that only supports DDR3, so your going to have to either change the memory or change the motherboard. Cheapest memory your gonna find is http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231149


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## TheMatt (May 9, 2006)

Don't waste money on DDR2 1066MHz RAM for any rig right now, even if the motherboard supports it. High end DDR2 800MHz RAM with low latencies and tight timings is the way to go for best performance.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820227089
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820146565


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## ajensl (Feb 8, 2008)

TheMatt; so you're saying DDR2 _will_fit on this motherboard? Or do I need to get DDR3 RAM?


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## themisiek1 (Aug 20, 2007)

DDR2 will fit and work. The real question is not whether it will fit because DDR2 and DDR3 are both the same size (240 pin). The real question is will it work and the answer is yes.


Woah, wait a minute. I just looked at the specs on newegg, tigerdirect, and the asus website. Non of them mention any support for DDR2 so I don't know.


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## ajensl (Feb 8, 2008)

It IS DDR2 800Mhz, not 1066Mhz.

I just read somewhere else that it wouldn't fit on that mobo so I went and changed it.

Ah well, I don't have to pay up front, parents are paying and I'll pay 'em back in installments so it doesn't matter too much. They'll just be a little pissed at forking out an extra ~$250 on the spot.

Should I keep the DDR3 or revert to DDR2 800mhz?? As long as you're sure that:

Kington ValueRAM 2x 1gb stick 800mhz CL5 will fit on an Asus Maximus Extreme Motherboard which gives no mention of supporting DDR2. I trust all your jedi like knowledge, and I'd rather get DDR2 for the moment but problem is I'm worried it isn't going to physically fit.


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## TheMatt (May 9, 2006)

My apologies, I am getting my Asus Maximus boards mixed up. The Maximus Extreme takes only DDR3; the Maximus Formula takes only DDR2.

I would recommend you go with the Maximus Formula because that takes DDR2 and DDR3 at current speeds is actually slower than DDR2. At higher speeds that will be utilized in computers with faster FSB speeds the DDR3 RAM will pull ahead of the DDR2 RAM.


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## ajensl (Feb 8, 2008)

I thought that's what might be happening here.

My reason for going with something that supports DDR3 is I want a mobo that will stand the test of time a little better. Long story short after this I'm pretty much on my own in terms of buying expensive stuff so I want some lastability in this thing. But if you're saying DDR3 would only be worth it with a board which has a faster FSB meaning more expensive then I might go with the Formula. It'd drop the price heaps I'd imagine just not having to buy DDR3 RAM (what a freakin' rip off).

Anyone else care to decide for me?

Keep the Maximus Extreme and buy DDR3?
Switch to Maximus Formula and revert to DDR2?


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## emosun (Oct 4, 2006)

If you can afford ddr3 then get it I say.


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## floydfan (Oct 18, 2006)

theres no reason to get ddr3, you have to pay alot more for the board and the memory, for a marginal increase at best. ddr2 will still be around for a long time, and the mobo is a dead end anyways, the best you will be able to do is get a quad core later on, intel's new architecture (nehalem) thats gonna come out at the end of the year will require a new socket. by then, ddr3 will be faster and cheaper than it is now.


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## emosun (Oct 4, 2006)

ddr3 is a lot faster then ddr2 and supports higher memory on a single stick , but your right it is in its early years. Its would be like buying a ddr2 board with a socket 478. The best thing would be to find a board that supports ddr2 and ddr3. So you can get the cheap memory now and always upgrade in the future.


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## ajensl (Feb 8, 2008)

I'd buy a motherboard that supports DDR2 and DDR3, but isn't that going be kinda hard to find? I thought that the physical RAM slot on the motherboard would be different for both (like DDR and DDR2).

The way technology is going at the moment I would have thought that DDR3 would become the standard fairly quickly.

New architechture at the end of the year you say? Hmm...maybe DDR2 is the way to go. Gakk...I really don't know. I've got the money for DDR3 but if the board is going to be useless for upgrading after a year...this ***** is doing my head in. Who would of thought buying a new computer would be this hard?:4-dontkno Actually, I knew it'd be this hard...damn this.

Am I going to run into any problems with XP w/SP2 running this hardware? Is there some terrible incompatibility that I don't yet know about that forces me to upgrade to (blech) Vista?


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## emosun (Oct 4, 2006)

Not really just make sure if you have 3 or more gb of ram that you have the 64 bit version of vista or xp.

As for a board that would support ddr2 and ddr3 I don't actually know if any exist but it would be ideal for now. It would probly have two slots for ddr2 and two seperate slots for ddr3. I think you should probly just get a ddr3 board, you can always reuse the ram in your new board if you upgrade the cpu/motherboard in the future.


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## floydfan (Oct 18, 2006)

yeah, he could get ddr3 now, but think about this: right now, ddr2 is less than half of ddr3 prices. if he gets ddr2 now, and ddr3 on a later upgrade, it will cost him the same amount of money in the end because by then ddr3 would have gone down to ddr2 prices, and the ddr3 he will get then will be the real deal after its had time to mature.


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## emosun (Oct 4, 2006)

He could go either way its really just a matter of if he wants to spend alot for alot of speed now or save some money and wait a year or so.


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## MaXXimus (Feb 7, 2008)

emosun I think you may need to do some more reading in regards to DDR3. I have yet to find one article that says anything in regards to DDR3 being worth buying... all have stated that DDR3 is no better then DDR2 right now. Thats why originally was going with a Maximus Extreme motherboard and DDR3 and then did some extensive research and opted for getting the Maximus Formula and DDR2 1066Mhz... and this will give me the same (if not better) performance and save me $700. I personally would never recommend anyone throwing their money out of the window. Now I did find a couple reviewers who said that DDR3 can give you a slight performance boost depending on your configuration... but still in the end they said it was only a 1% - 5% increase, so if you want to get that kind of performance increase for that insane amount of money then so be it... I would perfer to have a couple extra Raptors in my system.


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## emosun (Oct 4, 2006)

MaXXimus said:


> so if you want to get that kind of performance increase for that insane amount of money then so be it... I would perfer to have a couple extra Raptors in my system.


Arn't raptors another very expensive piece of hardware that barely increase the speed of a pc aswell? I mean really, you just got done saying that ddr3 is a waste of money for the extra speed.


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## themisiek1 (Aug 20, 2007)

Yea, Raptors are insanely expensive for hard drives. 72GB for 100 dollars, gezzzz...

Personally I would stay with DDR2 for now and within the next year or even couple monthes DDR3 prices should drop to near DDR2 prices now.


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## ajensl (Feb 8, 2008)

Hey I still can't decide whether to go DDR3 and Maximus Extreme or go back to DDR2 and a DDR2 board. I've narrowed it down to these four DDR2 boards:

Asus:
Striker II Formula
Maximus Formula
P5E-WS-PRO
P5N-T-Deluxe

Price is of no concern, has anyone heard anything about these boards? Had any troubles with them or positive experiences? Don't go nutso researching, I'm sure one is as good as the other, only difference I can see is that two use the X38 chipset an the other two are nForce SLi in varying degrees of advancement. I don't plan on using graphics cards in SLi so that really doesn't matter, I'm thinking then to go with the X38 as that seems to support a higher FSB. Your thoughts? I've also heard the nForce chipsets run hotter, is this true?


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## TheMatt (May 9, 2006)

I would go with the P5N-T Deluxe. The X38 is obsolete; if you can find the X48 and really want to invest in DDR3 then I would go with that.


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## ajensl (Feb 8, 2008)

Hey so I'm still in the design phase. I've decided to go with DDR3 for that little bit more lastability, considering that's the main thing I'm going for here. (Yeah I know, Nehalem and all that.) But I just thought I'd check back with you guys and see if you all approve:

CPU: Intel Core 2 Quad E6600 2.4Ghz
Mobo: Asus P5E3 Pro mobo (1600FSB, DDR3, X38 chipset)
Gfx: XFX 8800GTS 512mb
RAM: Kingston 2x1gb DDR3 @ 1066mhz CL7
HDD: 2x Seagate 250Gb 16mb cache
PSU: Antec 650w
CPU cooler: Zalman 9500A

Is there anything I should change? It's going to be used mainly for gaming so I was wondering if I should go an Intel Core 2 Duo E6850 3.0Ghz and keep it dual-core. But I figured quad core would mean the whole thing will last a tad longer as games get more geared toward supporting more cores.

Also will a 650w PSU be enough to support a 8800GTS?
And I'm looking at overclocking the CPU in the future, not just yet. But later on, should I be looking at a different motherboard or CPU cooler in that case? I cbf with water cooling atm so I wont be doing anything to extreme. Just squeezing a few more seasons out of the hardware till I bite the bullet and my wallet again.


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## emosun (Oct 4, 2006)

Everything looks good, I would probly go with an 8800 GT tho and not the GTS. Other than that I like it.


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## TheMatt (May 9, 2006)

I would not spend the money on DDR3 just yet. You can get the 750i now with DDR2 and save a ton of money.


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## ajensl (Feb 8, 2008)

I got some real techeads in another forum to design a PC based on my budget, and they came up with this:

CPU: Intel BX80562Q6600 ( http://www.scorptec.com.au/product/25094/) 

Mobo: Gigabyte GA-EP35-DS3P - ( http://www.scorptec.com.au/product/25766/) 

RAM: Kingston KHX8500D2K2/2GN ( http://www.scorptec.com.au/product/24489/) 

Gfx card: ASUS EAH3870X2-HTDI-1Gb ( http://www.scorptec.com.au/product/26102/) 

PSU: Antec 650w 

DVD-RW: Pioneer DVR-215BK ( http://www.scorptec.com.au/product/25101/) 

CPU cooler:Thermalright ULTRA-120-EX ( http://www.scorptec.com.au/product/23093/) 

2x250Gb Seagate HDD 16mb cache 

Fan: Noctua NF-R8-1800 - ( http://www.scorptec.com.au/product/25799/) 

In your opinion which is better? Mainly gonna be used for gaming. Maybe a little bit of over-clocking. The cost difference between the two is neligible, I'm thinking an amalgamation of his design and mine. But I don't know, you guys do.
Thanks for all the feedback thus far.


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## ajensl (Feb 8, 2008)

Sorry for the double post. I've basicallly designed two different systems, one's DDR2 and one's DDR3. The price difference is slim and doesn't really matter, and the graphics card is the other change. Which do you think will last longer/be more suited to gaming?

CPU: Intel Core 2 Quad Q6600 @ 2.4Ghz
Mobo: Asus P5E64 WS Pro
RAM: Kingston 2x1Gb DDR3 @ 1066mMhz
Gfx card: XFX 8800GTS 512mb 
HDD1: Seagate 250Gb 16mb 7200RPM
HDD2: Same as above.
Optical drive: Pioneer dual-layer 20x DVD-RW
Case: Silverstone Kublai 01
PSU: Antec 650w
CPU heatsink: Thermalright Ultra 120
CPU fan: Noctuna P12 1300RPM

OR

CPU: Intel Core 2 Quad Q6600 @ 2.4Ghz
Mobo: Gigabyte EX38-DS4
RAM: Kingston 2x1Gb DDR2 @ 1066Mhz
Gfx card: Asus 3870X2 1Gb
HDD1: Seagate 250Gb 16mb 7200RPM
HDD2: Same as above.
Optical drive: Pioneer dual-layer 20x DVD-RW
Case: Silverstone Kublai 01
PSU: Antec 650w
CPU heatsink: Thermalright Ultra 120
CPU fan: Noctuna P12 1300RPM

Thanks for all your help.


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## emosun (Oct 4, 2006)

I'd would go with the ddr3 setup if you can afford it. But change the 8800 gts to a gt. It would also probly be cheaper to get one 500gig hdd then two 250gig hdds.


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## ajensl (Feb 8, 2008)

Someone on this forum told me to go with 2x250Gb drives. I'm guessing their reasoning was that if one conks out then I've still got a functioning computer. But I like having 2 drives anyway, and there's only about $10 price difference between the two options.

Why do you say 8800GT over either a GTS or a 3870X2?
I've seen the 3870X2 smoke the 8800 GT/GTS in benchmarks and in Fraps testing in-game. Is it just because the new Catalyst drivers that support it aren't out yet? Or because games have to add support to it before it works how it's s'posed to?
Forums are pretty much divided over this, as well as whether to go Q6600 or not. I'd love to go E8400 but they're not in stock till end of April and I've already been waiting ages for a new PC. I can always just upgrade later.


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## emosun (Oct 4, 2006)

Oh, I said 8800 gt because its only about 200 and thought you were trying to keep costs down. But if you got 500 to spend on a 3870 x2 then go with that.


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## ajensl (Feb 8, 2008)

Nah if I go with a DDR2 board and RAM (there's not much point going with the DDR3 I chose seeing as its the same frequency @ 1066Mhz) the surplus funds leaves me with enough for a 3870X2.


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