# Upgrading



## MattPlan (Jul 23, 2012)

This is my first post on these forums and up until now have been unable to get a decent amount of advice :/

Ok so I've had my computer for 4 years, I had it custom made for me. It's running Windows XP Service Pack 2, so question one, is it worth upgrading to Windows 7? 

The specs of my PC include:
NVIDIA GeForce 9600 GT
2GB RAM
Motherboard: K9N6SGM-V
ACE 400X (Power Supply)
Processor: AMD Athlon 64 X2 Dual Core Processor 4600+
Running DirectX 9.0
232GB Hard Drive (Size of my C: Drive)

I use my computer for Gaming mostly, things such as Doom 3, Counter-Strike, Guild Wars 2, LotRO, WoW - So performance is important

I can't specify my exact budget, but I'd like to try and keep it as low as possible  So can anyone help me? I heard that all the parts need to be able to be compatible with each other, so any advice would be awesome! 

-Matt


----------



## Thrall (Feb 19, 2011)

Hi and welcome to TSF. :smile:

In my honest opinion I don't think it would be worth it to upgrade to Windows 7. 
With that system you have I don't think you would see any increase in performance, in fact I think you would see a drop in the performance based on the fact that Windows 7 is more demanding then Windows XP. 

However what you can do is update Windows XP to service pack 3.


----------



## MattPlan (Jul 23, 2012)

Ok  However, I opened up my PC and checked the RAM slots, of I had 4GB of RAM would it be worth upgrading?

Also can anyone suggest a better build based on the specs I provided?

Matt


----------



## Thrall (Feb 19, 2011)

Even with 4 GB of memory I still don't think you would see much of an improvement in performance by upgrading to Windows 7. Of course I am not saying you can't upgrade but I wouldn't expect better performance with that system.
Windows XP is also still less demanding on the memory then Windows 7. XP demands 64 mb (128 mb recommended) while Windows 7 32 bit version demands 1 GB and 64 bit version demands 2 GB of memory. 

As for recommending a build its a bit difficult as you haven't really told us your budget, like whats your limit and also we don't know where you shop for parts. 
I would recommend taking a look at our sticky in this section for building a new computer and see if there is anything there that might be what you are looking for: http://www.techsupportforum.com/for...evised-2012-and-updated-regularly-448272.html


----------



## Tyree (May 10, 2009)

Your PC can run 7 but don't expect the best possible experience.
Windows 7 Upgrade Advisor - Download - Microsoft Windows


----------



## MattPlan (Jul 23, 2012)

Ok, well let's say my limit would be..£700? £800 at the most. 


Matt


----------



## Tyree (May 10, 2009)

£800 is a little over $1200 US
http://www.techsupportforum.com/for...evised-2012-and-updated-regularly-448272.html


----------



## MattPlan (Jul 23, 2012)

I've noted down the $1200 AMD system, can I take these parts to a nearby shop and have them assemble it?


----------



## Tyree (May 10, 2009)

That should be possible but I would check with the prospective shop to be certain and get a price.


----------



## MattPlan (Jul 23, 2012)

Because these prices are in dollars I assume they're from US websites? Is it possible to buy from the UK sites? To save on delivery?


----------



## Thrall (Feb 19, 2011)

I would recommend buying the parts from Overclockers UK - Computer components, hardware & gaming PC. It should have all the parts listed in the thread we gave you the link for.


----------



## MattPlan (Jul 23, 2012)

In terms of the LG Black 24x (In the $1200 AMD build)
This is all I can find at Overclockers
LG GH24NS90 24x DVD±RW SATA ReWriter (Black) - OEM [GH24NS70.AUAA ]


----------



## Thrall (Feb 19, 2011)

I would go for that one. It looks good and it has only positive reviews.


----------



## MattPlan (Jul 23, 2012)

Regarding the CPU Cooler 
Which of these would you pick Overclockers UK Search Results


----------



## Thrall (Feb 19, 2011)

Unless you plan on overclocking the stock cooler/heatsink that comes with the CPU will be sufficent so no need to buy a cooler.


----------



## MattPlan (Jul 23, 2012)

AMD Phenom II X4 Quad Core 965 Black Edition "125W Edition" 3.40GHz (Socket AM3) - Retail [HDZ965FBGMBOX]
So is that a good CPU? I couldn't find the 975


----------



## Thrall (Feb 19, 2011)

In my opinion that CPU is good and the Phenom II x4 975 would only give you a small increase in performance so it isn't really that much greater then the Phenom II x4 965. So I say go for it.


----------



## MattPlan (Jul 23, 2012)

4G of RAM for that system seems small, couldn't I get 2 4GB? So I'd have 8GB?


----------



## MattPlan (Jul 23, 2012)

Also, would this be the right hard drive (in the $1200 AMD build) 
Western Digital Caviar Black 500GB SATA 6Gb/s 32MB Cache - OEM (WD5002AALX) []


----------



## Thrall (Feb 19, 2011)

Since RAM isn't that expensive going for 8GB isn't a bad idea. Just remember to check that the ram is compatible with the motherboard you are buying.
The only reason we recommend 4 GB of RAM is because most games currently don't demand more then that.

Edit: That looks like the right harddrive.


----------



## MattPlan (Jul 23, 2012)

Is this the right motherboard? I couldn't find it on Overclockers
Gigabyte SKT-AM3+ 990FXA-UD5 Motherboard (Rev 1.0):Amazon:Computers & Accessories


----------



## Thrall (Feb 19, 2011)

Yes that is the correct motherboard. I couldn't find it on overclockers either but good thing you found it elsewhere :smile:


----------



## MattPlan (Jul 23, 2012)

http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/aw/d/B00...de=asn&creative=22206&creativeASIN=B0053P9IHI

Is that the motherboard? I c


----------



## MattPlan (Jul 23, 2012)

Sorry xD
I'm having trouble lOcating the power supply :/


----------



## Thrall (Feb 19, 2011)

Assuming that you can find the Radeon HD 6950 as recommended but can't find the power supply I can recommend a couple of power supplies which are on 750W and would be sufficent which are these: Corsair Enthusiast Series TX 750W V2 High Performance '80 Plus Bronze' Power Supply (CMPSU-750TXV2UK) [CMPSU-750TXV2UK] or this: XFX 750W XXX Edition Modular '80 Plus Silver' Power Supply [P1-750B-NLG9]

And once again, you did find the correct motherboard :smile:

Edit: This is the power supply listed in the build thread: Corsair Enthusiast Series TX 850W V2 High Performance '80 Plus Bronze' Power Supply (CMPSU-850TXV2UK) [CMPSU-850TXV2UK]


----------



## MattPlan (Jul 23, 2012)

I can't see the Radeon in my specs? Which is that?


----------



## MattPlan (Jul 23, 2012)

Oh I see, the video card?

UK-Computers Online Catalogue, 11188-22-20G,Sapphire Radeon HD 6950 Graphic Card,820 MHz Core,2 GB GDDR5 SDRAM,PCI Express 2.0 x16,5000 MHz Memory Clock,2560 x 1600,CrossFireX,Fan Cooler,DirectX 11.0, DirectCompute, OpenGL 4.2, OpenCL,HDMI,DisplayPor


----------



## Thrall (Feb 19, 2011)

Yes that is correct, I did mean the video card.


----------



## MattPlan (Jul 23, 2012)

Good good, it's just my bro says most things will be 64bit in a few years anyway, so 8GB for 64bit Windows 7 would be good.

Also must I really pay that for much for the case? Or is it because it's measured for this?


----------



## Tyree (May 10, 2009)

Cases are a personal choice and, IMHO, $160 US is too much for any case.
CoolerMaster & Antec are good quality and I'm sure you could fine one you like for less.


----------



## MattPlan (Jul 23, 2012)

I understand, but aren't they measured up to the parts? The case might be too big or small?


----------



## Tyree (May 10, 2009)

As long as the case is Mid-Tower or above, you should be good. Find one/some you like, post a link and we can advise.


----------



## MattPlan (Jul 23, 2012)

Ok  So everything I've linked so far checks out?


----------



## Thrall (Feb 19, 2011)

Well if I got it correctly you have so far found the following:

Motherboard: Gigabyte SKT-AM3+ 990FXA-UD5 Motherboard (Rev 1.0):Amazon:Computers & Accessories
CPU: AMD Phenom II X4 Quad Core 965 Black Edition "125W Edition" 3.40GHz (Socket AM3) - Retail [HDZ965FBGMBOX]
DVD/CD rom: LG GH24NS90 24x DVD±RW SATA ReWriter (Black) - OEM [GH24NS70.AUAA ]
HDD: Western Digital Caviar Black 500GB SATA 6Gb/s 32MB Cache - OEM (WD5002AALX) []
Video card: UK-Computers Online Catalogue, 11188-22-20G,Sapphire Radeon HD 6950 Graphic Card,820 MHz Core,2 GB GDDR5 SDRAM,PCI Express 2.0 x16,5000 MHz Memory Clock,2560 x 1600,CrossFireX,Fan Cooler,DirectX 11.0, DirectCompute, OpenGL 4.2, OpenCL,HDMI,DisplayPor
PSU:  Corsair Enthusiast Series TX 850W V2 High Performance '80 Plus Bronze' Power Supply (CMPSU-850TXV2UK) [CMPSU-850TXV2UK] or any of the others I listed which is:  Corsair Enthusiast Series TX 750W V2 High Performance '80 Plus Bronze' Power Supply (CMPSU-750TXV2UK) [CMPSU-750TXV2UK] and  XFX 750W XXX Edition Modular '80 Plus Silver' Power Supply [P1-750B-NLG9]
RAM: 8 GB but you didn't say which you would go for.
Case: Not decided.

Looks good to me so far. Once you post which case you had in mind and which memory modules you will go for we can advise better.


----------



## MattPlan (Jul 23, 2012)

Can yo suggest a decent 8GB RAM for this build?


----------



## Tyree (May 10, 2009)

2x4GB matched pair of 1333 or 1600MHZ G.Skill or Corsair.


----------



## MattPlan (Jul 23, 2012)

Crucial 4GB (1x4GB) DDR3 PC3-10600C9 1333MHz 204-Pin SODIMM Module (CT51264BC1339) [CT51264BC1339]


----------



## Tyree (May 10, 2009)

That's laptop RAM and you want to purchase a matched pair.


----------



## MattPlan (Jul 23, 2012)

Corsair XMS3 8GB (2x4GB) DDR3 PC3-10666C9 1333MHz Dual Channel Kit (CMX8GX3M2A1333C9) [CMX8GX3M2A1333C9]


----------



## Thrall (Feb 19, 2011)

You shouldn't have any problem with that memory, it is compatible with the motherboard you selected according to Corsair's memory finder on their website.


----------



## Tyree (May 10, 2009)

As noted, that RAM is a good choice. Good quality Mobo's rarely have any issues with good quality RAM.


----------



## toothman (Jul 13, 2008)

Looks like a great quality system that will run Windows 7 like and make your old machine's performance look like a Game Boy :grin:

If that comfortably fits your budget then go for it.

As for your original system, it would run a lot better if you put another 1.5GB of RAM in it and would make an excellent gift.


----------



## MattPlan (Jul 23, 2012)

http://www.amazon.co.uk/CiT-Vantage...1_2?s=computers&ie=UTF8&qid=1343146758&sr=1-2

Does something like this work?


----------



## Thrall (Feb 19, 2011)

That looks like a good case. So if you like it I say go for it.


----------



## MattPlan (Jul 23, 2012)

Ok. So what am I working with here?


----------



## Thrall (Feb 19, 2011)

Well here is what you got so far:

Motherboard:  Gigabyte SKT-AM3+ 990FXA-UD5 Motherboard (Rev 1.0):Amazon:Computers & Accessories
CPU:  AMD Phenom II X4 Quad Core 965 Black Edition "125W Edition" 3.40GHz (Socket AM3) - Retail [HDZ965FBGMBOX]
DVD/CD rom:  LG GH24NS90 24x DVD±RW SATA ReWriter (Black) - OEM [GH24NS70.AUAA ]
HDD:  Western Digital Caviar Black 500GB SATA 6Gb/s 32MB Cache - OEM (WD5002AALX) []
Video card:  UK-Computers Online Catalogue, 11188-22-20G,Sapphire Radeon HD 6950 Graphic Card,820 MHz Core,2 GB GDDR5 SDRAM,PCI Express 2.0 x16,5000 MHz Memory Clock,2560 x 1600,CrossFireX,Fan Cooler,DirectX 11.0, DirectCompute, OpenGL 4.2, OpenCL,HDMI,DisplayPor
PSU:  Corsair Enthusiast Series TX 850W V2 High Performance '80 Plus Bronze' Power Supply (CMPSU-850TXV2UK) [CMPSU-850TXV2UK] or any of the others I listed which is:  Corsair Enthusiast Series TX 750W V2 High Performance '80 Plus Bronze' Power Supply (CMPSU-750TXV2UK) [CMPSU-750TXV2UK] and  XFX 750W XXX Edition Modular '80 Plus Silver' Power Supply [P1-750B-NLG9]
RAM: Corsair XMS3 8GB (2x4GB) DDR3 PC3-10666C9 1333MHz Dual Channel Kit (CMX8GX3M2A1333C9) [CMX8GX3M2A1333C9]
Case: http://www.amazon.co.uk/CiT-Vantage-...3146758&sr=1-2

Now if you go for the cheapest PSU out of those I listed which would the Corsair TX 750W, this one:  Corsair Enthusiast Series TX 750W V2 High Performance '80 Plus Bronze' Power Supply (CMPSU-750TXV2UK) [CMPSU-750TXV2UK] then that brings you to a total of £633,82 excluding shipping I guess. So thats below your set budget and its a very decent build.


----------



## MattPlan (Jul 23, 2012)

I £511? Although I missed off the PSU


----------



## MattPlan (Jul 23, 2012)

Even with it I get £601.95


----------



## Thrall (Feb 19, 2011)

Well I counted the price with the VAT, don't know what means. Either way you are below the budget so its a good build.


----------



## MattPlan (Jul 23, 2012)

Well I'll double check when I'm home from work.


----------



## MattPlan (Jul 23, 2012)

You're sure these parts are all compatible? I'm buying them tomorrow


----------



## Thrall (Feb 19, 2011)

Yes the build is great. The components matches very well and most important they are high quality products so I guess we won't be seeing you for a few years until you come back asking for a new build :smile:


----------



## MattPlan (Jul 23, 2012)

Well I've t the building bit sorted!

But yes  I might come back before however, you guys were very helpful!


----------



## greenbrucelee (Apr 24, 2007)

You would need to get rid of most of your build for windows 7 and ram is best run as matched sets that are the same make and speed.

I am from the UK and generally buy from overclockers but I do aslo buy from Computer Hardware - Scan.co.uk and PC Components, Desktop PCs, Laptops, LCD TVs & Computer Hardware

Building a pc is not hard there are plenty of tutorials on youtube to watch.


----------



## Amd_Man (Jan 27, 2009)

Just a side note here: I have several X2 4600+ systems out there that are running Windows 7 with ease. Your new system though will be a night to day difference!


----------



## Tyree (May 10, 2009)

Before attempting to assemble anything, thoroughly read the Mobo manual to familiarize yourself with it's layout and connections. 
When that is accomplished do a bench test exactly as listed below.
Before installing the Mobo into the case, be certain you have one standoff, no more - no less, for every Mobo mounting hole.

Set the motherboard on a non conductive surface. The motherboard box is perfect for this. DO NOT PLACE THE MOTHERBOARD ON THE STATIC BAG! It can actually conduct electricity! 
Install the CPU and heat sink. 
Install 1 stick of RAM.
Install the video card and attach the power supply connection(s) to the card if your card needs it.
Connect the monitor to the video card.
Connect the power supply to the motherboard with both the 24pin main ATX Power connection and the separate 4 pin (Dual Core CPU) or 8 pin (Quad Core CPU) power connection.
Connect power to the power supply.
Do NOT connect ANYTHING else. Make sure you have the power connector on the CPU fan connected.
Use a small screwdriver to momentarily short the power switch connector on the motherboard. Consult your motherboard manual to find which two pins connect to your case's power switch. Then touch both pins with a screwdriver to complete the circuit and boot the system.

If all is well, it should power up and you should get a display. Then assemble the parts into the case and try again. If the system now fails to boot, you have a short in the case and need to recheck your motherboard standoffs.

If the system does not boot after this process, then you most likely have a faulty component. You'll need to swap parts, start with the power supply, until you determine what is defective.


----------



## MattPlan (Jul 23, 2012)

Ok so I've been told that Western Digital HDD's are prone to failure.. Is this true? What sort of risk is there? I should have all my stuff by the end of the week and should have it assembled soon after!


----------



## helios19 (Nov 25, 2008)

WD and Seagate are the top two HDD brands out there today! Who ever told you that is most likely talking from bad personal experience as oppose to fact.

There will always be risk with anything you buy... however buying good quality products from reputable brands just reduces the risk (it doesn't negate it).

Once you purchase all the hardware, bench test it (as Tyree stated) to identify if any components are faulty and need to be returned.


----------



## Tyree (May 10, 2009)

MattPlan said:


> Ok so I've been told that Western Digital HDD's are prone to failure.. Is this true?


Absolutely not.


----------



## toothman (Jul 13, 2008)

Every HDD has a decent chance to fail. Every one eventually will.

Seagate and WD are solid brands.


----------



## Thrall (Feb 19, 2011)

Agree compleatly with everyone else here. Western Digitial and Seagate are both solid brands and are very likely not to fail. 
So whoever told you that most likely had a bad experience with Western Digital drives.


----------



## MattPlan (Jul 23, 2012)

Just easing reviews for the stuff. Apparently the GFX Card is best used with something called a Crossfire bridge? 
And I'm concerned as to whether the case is big enough for the motherboard. Also u read one review where he bought one and then got a free replacement, both didn't work (The card) 

Anything to ease my mind here?:')


----------



## greenbrucelee (Apr 24, 2007)

you use a crossfire bridge when running crossfire i.e running two cards.

Faulty equipment does happen but they companies have RMA procedures it would be bad luck two have the same equipment arrive faulty twice.


----------



## Thrall (Feb 19, 2011)

You shouldn't need to think about Crossfire. Crossfire means using two graphic card off the same series, example two 6950. A single 6950 will be plenty to get the performance you want so there is no benefit to go Crossfire as the gain in performance isn't that much and also you would get other downsides such as more generated heat which means you would need to get better cooling in the case and the power demand would go up as well so you would need a better PSU. 

Not to mention that not all games is optimized for Crossfire so you may get some weird graphical artifacts. So its always best to use a single graphic card.

As for the case I doubt the motherboard won't fit.


----------



## MattPlan (Jul 23, 2012)

Is this the same card? Sapphire Radeon HD 6950 2 GB DDR5 DL-DVI-I/SL-DVI-D/HDMI/DP PCI-Express Graphics Card 100312-3L:Amazon:Electronics


----------



## greenbrucelee (Apr 24, 2007)

your link doesn't work but a 6950 on its own does not require a crossfire bridge. Crossfire and sli bridges are when you have two seperate cards. Not one dual card.


----------



## Thrall (Feb 19, 2011)

Yes thats the one I ment. That card alone without CrossFire (Which would actually require two of those) will give a great performance.


----------



## MattPlan (Jul 23, 2012)

I have forgot about the Sound card >< Do they cost a lot? Are they needed to start the computer?


----------



## Thrall (Feb 19, 2011)

No need for an external sound card really. The motherboard has a inbuilt sound card and the quality of those is actually very good. In probably all of my builds except maybe some of my first computers I haven't used a external sound card.


----------



## MattPlan (Jul 23, 2012)

We're a little wary of how to go about building this computer specifically. I understand it's easy to break things. Is there any possible guidance you could give? What to put in first, what I'll need, a step by step method if you have any time to detail it?

-Matt


----------



## Thrall (Feb 19, 2011)

Tyree said:


> Before attempting to assemble anything, thoroughly read the Mobo manual to familiarize yourself with it's layout and connections.
> When that is accomplished do a bench test exactly as listed below.
> Before installing the Mobo into the case, be certain you have one standoff, no more - no less, for every Mobo mounting hole.
> 
> ...


Just thought I would quote what Tyree said as that would be the best way to start really. If you still have questions after doing what Tyree suggests then feel free to ask them :smile:


----------



## MattPlan (Jul 23, 2012)

How do I go go about installing this stuff? Why does it specify to install only 1 stick of RAM?


----------



## MattPlan (Jul 23, 2012)

Is there a strict order to putting the components in the case?


----------



## Thrall (Feb 19, 2011)

Well I am not that good of explaining these kind of things so I would recommend taking a look at these videos as that will pretty much show you everything you need to know about putting the computer together:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RxaVBsXEiok&feature=relmfu
Newegg TV: How To Build a Computer - Part 2 - The Build - YouTube
Newegg TV: How To Build a Computer - Part 3 - Installing Windows & Finishing Touches - YouTube


----------



## greenbrucelee (Apr 24, 2007)

You should build outside the case firts to make sure everything works then put stuff in the case when you know everything is ok.


----------



## MattPlan (Jul 23, 2012)

Is there any preferred surface to build on outside the case?


----------



## greenbrucelee (Apr 24, 2007)

ontop of the motherboard box or cardboard. The bottom of the motherboard has capacitors which can conduct electricty or get damaged so do not put a motherboard on top of an anti static bag or metal.


----------



## MattPlan (Jul 23, 2012)

So I have to build the computer outside the case first? Sounds complicated!


----------



## greenbrucelee (Apr 24, 2007)

no it isn't.

If you buid inside the case and something doesn't work then you have to take everything out the case then rebuild outside the case so you can remove components one by one until you identify what component is wrong.

You can put the power supply and dvd and hard drive in the case (as long as your cables reach, if they dont then you will need everything outside) then do everything on the motherboard like ram,cpu, graphics card. Then if everything works all you need to do is screw in the board you dont need to remove the cpu,gpu or anything put onto the motherboard.

Building a computer is not hard, dont stress about it. It is very easy.

There is really only one thing you can get wrong and that is plugging in the hard drives power cable the wrong way as it fits both ways. Doing it wrong will make the hard drive die but you cannot plug anything else in the wrong way.


----------



## greenbrucelee (Apr 24, 2007)

just follow the videos Thrall posted they show you what I have just explained.


----------



## MattPlan (Jul 23, 2012)

With the motherboard must I install a processor or a heat sink?


----------



## Tyree (May 10, 2009)

Both. 
Read the Mobo manual thoroughly and familiarize your self with all the connectors. It will also guide you through the install.


----------



## MattPlan (Jul 23, 2012)

This graphics card is quite big, I'm a bit unsure if it will fit in the motherboard or in the case! I've decided to take my build into a lOcal shop to let them put it together, as they are probably more expert than me


----------



## Thrall (Feb 19, 2011)

It will certainly fit on the motherboard and should also fit in the case. I read some reviews about the case you selected and there should be a plastic plate inside that can be removed to be able to use longer graphic cards. 

I am sure the local shop will figure that one out, and it is a wise choice to get them to do it for you, if you don't feel confident about building the computer yourself. I hope everything works out great, let us know how it goes :smile:


----------



## greenbrucelee (Apr 24, 2007)

It really isn't a difficult thing to build a computer. It's just like a jigsaw puzzle.

If you follow the videos that Thrall posted you can't go wrong.


----------



## Tyree (May 10, 2009)

If you don't feel competent to do the build then taking it to a shop is probably OK but it's not at all difficult if you read the Mobo manual and watch some assembly videos.
Doing it yourself will also assist you if/when any problems arise.


----------

