# Random freeze - A8N-SLI Premium



## LucidEsquire (Oct 13, 2005)

Hi all...I am currently experiencing frustrating freezes

My system is:
A8N-SLI premium
Athlon 3500+
2GB (4x512) Legend DDR400
Leadtek PX6600 GT TDH Extreme
Super Flower 500W plugNpower PSU

This system is randomly freezing, mouse keyboard and ctrl-alt-del does nothing...have to do reboot.

I have exhaused every option with no luck

temp - avg 41 deg C (max 51)
memtest - no errors (5 hours)
HD scan all ok
Got Bios 1008, chipset drivers from ASUS website
Have done a complete reinstall of XP with bare bones software.
PSU is brand new

I think I have followed all the advice I can find for these sort of problems that others have experienced, but nothing seems to change it. It has sometimes produced BSOD and then reboots but have remedied that, but still get random freezes, with no particular trigger identified. The event viewer in computer management does not show any errors straight after reboot.

Any suggestions????


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## Tumbleweed36 (May 14, 2005)

HI,

I know you probably won't want to hear this, but how many amps are on each rail of your power supply. Also, might be a good idea to use Probe to see what voltages are being put out on each rail of your power supply.


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## LucidEsquire (Oct 13, 2005)

*PSU specs*

Here are the specs on the PSU

+3.3V: 0.3-35 Amp
+5V: 1.0-45 Amp
+12V1: 1.0-18 Amp
+12V2: 1.0-20 Amp
-5V: 0-0.5 Amp
-12V: 0-0.8 Amp
+5VSB: 0-2.5 Amp

I use probe and get

+12V: 11.712 
+5V: 5.026 
+3.3V: 3.36
VCore: 1.504

These voltages are stable and only very small flucuations have been observed on occasion, but still well within the +-5% allowable from what I have read. At this stage am very willing to hear anything that may solve this problem, changing the PCU, mobo or GPU are undesirable but all else is fair game. I am borrowing a different GPU today to see if maybe that is the issue, will post results.


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## linderman (May 20, 2005)

Welcome to TSF:

I would start by replacing your underpowered PSU with a "quality" 600 watt unit. SLI systems are very power hungry and *very finicky * about the quality and the need for consistent "clean" power. I highly reccommend an Enermax EG751 "SLI-ready" power supply (about $150.00) . check the prices on ebay or newegg.com for comparision.

here is a "quality" comparison chart for your review 


regards / joe


ATX Power Supplies - Brands from A to Z 

*** RATED BY QUALITY ***

Key
H = High Quality (Good Solid Reliable Brand)
L = Low Quality (Cheap Generic)
M = Medium Quality (In-between)
U = Unknown


A-Power................L
A-Top..................L
A+GPB..................L
AcBel..................L
AC Ryan (Ryanpower)....L
Aerocool...............U
AG.....................L
Ahanix.................L
Akasa..................L
Allied.................L
Antec..................M/H
AOpen..................L
APC....................L
Apex Allied............L
Aspire.................L/M
Astec..................L
Athena.................L
BFG....................L
Broadway Gaming........U
Channel Well...........L
CHAS...................L
Chenbro................U
Chieftec...............L
Coba...................L
Codegen................L
Conrad.................M
CoolerMaster...........H
CoolMax................M
Crystal................L
Dell...................L
Delta..................L
Diablo.................L
Eagle..................L
Echo Star..............L
Enermax................H
Engleking..............M
Enlight................M
Epson..................L
FDK....................L
Fortron (FSP)..........H
Gateway................L
Gazelle Multimedia.....L
Global Marketing.......L
GPower.................L
Guardian...............L
Herolchi...............M
Hipro..................L
HP/Compaq..............L
HPC International......L
Huntkey................L
I-Star.................L
IBM Redundant..........U (expensive)
Intel Redundant........U (expensive)
In Win.................L
Jaguar.................U
Kensington.............L
Kingwin................L
L&C....................L
Leadman................L
Levicom................L
LiteOn.................U
Logisys................U
Mad Dog................L/M
Maxtron................L
MGE....................L
MGE Vortec.............M
MorningStar............L
NEC....................L
Newton.................L
Nexus..................L
Noise Magic............L
NorthQ.................M
Nspire.................L
OCZ....................H
Omega..................L
Packard Bell...........L
PC Power & Cooling.....H
PC-World (PCW).........L
PCMCIS.................U
Power..................L
PowerStream............L
PowerTek...............L
PowerUp................L
PowMax.................L
PowMax XPower..........L
Premium................L
Pyramid................L
Q-Tec..................L
Q-Technology...........L
RaidMax................U
Real Power.............L
Rosewill...............L
SCS....................L
SeaSonic...............H
Shuttle................L
Silent Purepower.......U
SilenX.................L
Silverstone............H
Sky Hawk (Eagle Tech)..L
Sparkle................H
Star Micronics.........L
StarTech...............L
Sun....................L
SuperFlower............L
Supermicro.............L
Tagan..................H
Task...................L
ThermalTake............M
Topower................L
Tri-Mag................L
TSP....................L
Tyan Tiger.............L
TTGI...................L
Ultra-Power Computer...L
Ultra..................M
Ultra X-Connect........L
Vantec.................H
Verax..................H
Vigor..................U
Xion...................L
xPCgear................L
Zalman.................H
Zippy..................L


Thanks Whodat / for the link !!


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## LucidEsquire (Oct 13, 2005)

I have just fitted a Enermax EG701 600W PSU...very nice stable voltages

but froze anyway!!!! Arghhhhh


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## LucidEsquire (Oct 13, 2005)

As it stands now:

Have had one freeze within half an hour of new PSU installation, was how ever multitasking a lot. System resouurces and heat all seemed fine though.

One thing I have not mentioned earlier is that I am running two monitors off the one GPU - Leadtek PX6600 GT TDH Extreme. For the first time I experienced a jam on my second one, the system was still operational but I could not click on the second screen. I opened monitor properties on first screen, shut down dual view and then set it to on again and it was all ok.

After about 2 hours of operation I experienced a BSOD, it appeared really quickly and then straight to reboot. I did however see one line with "win32k" that's really vague I know but it only displayed for a split second. I checked the event viewer and nothing!

I know this GPU can run two screens but does number of windows and the like affect system performace a possible cause this problem?


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## please (Mar 2, 2005)

@ LucidEsquire
Certainly running dual monitors will tax your GPU. It depends on the resolutions and refresh rates you are trying to run. You could try backing off of them a bit and see if that helps. Are you able to monitor your GPU temps?

It is a bit strange that no catagory in windows event viewer says anything concerning your freezes.


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## linderman (May 20, 2005)

Hello / well the install of the enermax will be a huge help for you in the end / nothing rots quite like burning up expensive componets !!

I would try taking off the side case of your computer and blowing a house fan into it / then multi task the snot out it !! if you get no freezes then the answer will be added cooling or air flow for your vid cards !! 


let us know / i am in suspense now !


regards

joe


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## LucidEsquire (Oct 13, 2005)

Yeah I tried that before the Enermax PSU and didn't change anything. It seems to be pretty stable at moment. When have downloads going, ie. Azureus, it seems to be a bit more prone to doing it. My thinking is that it is trying to acess too many parts of HD at once and can't cope? (not using SATA yet) But when am multitasking without DL has been very stable in comparison to before.

The new PSU has made a big difference. Will be running some models later which is where it had been falling over before...will post when have some results.

The issue that has arisen now is one of my displays freezes and then does refresh as if coming out of hibernation. Has refreshed automatically and have had to do manually. Am monitoring the GPU temp with winfox and reads around the 42 deg C mark.


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## LucidEsquire (Oct 13, 2005)

*High quality PSU...What an investment*

So far no freeze...have got 2 screens full of windows and applications, can run models and still seems to hold up ok. Even have some downloads going.

The screen has a couple of glitches, trailing and refreshing as mentioned before. Doesn't happen often.

I can't belive that it may have all been due to the PSU! Will keep posting further problems when they arise.


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## linderman (May 20, 2005)

have you tried memory testing prog yet ??????? memtest86.com (free)

also monitor you cpu usage % and memory usuage % with the Ctrl Alt Delete keys > go to task manger then perfromance 

then push the snot out of it and see if its using all your cpu resources and memory resources / I dont see anyway it possibly could unless you have a snail of a hard drive ?????

also download everest home edition (free) and check some other things like system temps / system voltages/ cpu temps ???? post them in here for evaluation 
http://www.lavalys.com/products/overview.php?pid=1&lang=en

also ??? how do you connect to the internet for downloading lan, modem, cable modem, dsl ??????

*make and model of hard drive please * ?????

we will get to the bottom of this dilemma 

regards

joe


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## LucidEsquire (Oct 13, 2005)

Yep ran the memtest86 for 5 and a bit hours - no errors

Have been monitoring all temps and voltages through ASUSprobe, Winfox and checked temps in bios, all seem ok. I have the voltage settings within bios set to auto.

Can't seem to overload it at moment, as you said. Performing nicely! The hardware monitors all indicate resonable ranges and are stable. The glitch now is the monitor refreshing. It is very intermitent and doesn't cause any system crashes or freezes. I have not been able to freeze it like was happening before?

I have run everest...great program...I have a complete report but it is very long.Let me know if require more than this:

--------[ Sensor ]------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Sensor Properties:
Sensor Type ITE IT8712F (ISA 290h)
GPU Sensor Type National LM89 (NV-I2C 4Ch)
Motherboard Name Asus A8N-E / A8N-SLI Series

Temperatures:
Motherboard 40 °C (104 °F)
CPU 42 °C (108 °F)
GPU 44 °C (111 °F)
GPU Ambient 35 °C (95 °F)
WDC WD800BB-55JKA0 33 °C (91 °F)

Cooling Fans:
CPU 3309 RPM

Voltage Values:
CPU Core 1.50 V
+3.3 V 3.33 V
+5 V 5.00 V
+12 V 11.84 V
+5 V Standby 4.81 V
VBAT Battery 3.09 V
Debug Info F 33 FF FF
Debug Info T 42 40 34
Debug Info V 5E 00 D0 BA B9 BD 00 (F7)

Looking through the report I have seen one stand out point and that was 

--------[ Power Management ]--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Power Management Properties:
Current Power Source AC Line
Battery Status No Battery
Full Battery Lifetime Unknown
Remaining Battery Lifetime Unknown

Should there not be a battery spec???

My HD is a 80GB Western Digital Caviar (WD800BB-55JKAO)

Internet connection is cable (UL/128) using port 60000 for listen in software

Thanks for the invaluable help, it is saving my sanity!!!


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## linderman (May 20, 2005)

Hello:

The battery spec message under "power management systems"
is used if you have one the battery pack / surge protection back-up devices i.e. if the power dies it supplies enough juice to do a power windows shut down / Power Chute makes the most popular line of APC's (usually on high end business desktops and servers)

Like you said / I dont see any problem "hot" spots / your temps are awesome / your voltages are great 
no memory errors / ???????

i am stumped on your shutdowns now / unless it's a monitor refresh rate dilemma ?????

Your hard drive is not a snail so it shouldnt be getting too bottled up although it not a rocket either  the 2 meg cache means the processor is going to be tied up more than it could or should be / its kinda like carrying water with a 2 gallon bucket / you have to make alot trips to the well 

a western digital 7200 rpm drive ATA 133 *8meg cache * would improve things for the CPU / if you see it getting maxed out ???????? such drives in the 40 gig range are cheap on ebay / food for thought 

awesome system / i wish santa would bring me one for x-mas 


keep us posted 

joe


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## LucidEsquire (Oct 13, 2005)

Ok, here's where it stands:

It has been pretty much freeze free all day except for a few minor trailing windows and monitior refreshes. This stayed the same even while ripping CD's, running programs and some MATLAB models. Which is a lot better than what it was capable of when I started this forum.

Early tonite it went quickly to blue screen and did reboot, this happened during multitasking operations but in particular when I was resizing some windows on the primary display.

I have checked the event viewer and under applications have found the following for the reboot time.

Source: EventSystem
Category: (50)
Event ID: 4609

The COM+ Event System detected a bad return code during its internal processing. HRESULT was C0000005 from line 44 of d:\qxp_slp\com\com1x\src\events\tier1\eventsystemobj.cpp. Please contact Microsoft Product Support Services to report this error.

For more information, see Help and Support Center at http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/events.asp.

I have gone to MS but they have no help on their knowledge database. Is this event equivalent to what the BSOD would have said...or is there another way of retrieving that data? The same error has occured 2.5 hours earlier and 2 hours prior to that with no reboot. These two instances might have corresponded to some monitor problems mentioned earlier but can't be sure of times.


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## LucidEsquire (Oct 13, 2005)

I just changes some IE settings and it did the logout thing, but when logged back in I sent an error report to MS. It came back with that I had had a severe hardware crash with four possiblities:
1. RAM (checked that know its not it)
2. CPU (hope not only had it since July, can I test it somehow?)
3. MoBo (shouldn't be only had it since Sept)
4. PSU (all good)

Don't know why it sent this error report as didn't crash, only changed settings and IE logged out user to apply them.

It seems to be ok now, bout to start working it again. Is this just a MS glitch or am I in toruble?


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## linderman (May 20, 2005)

I am wondering now if you have a crappy OS install / sometimes when you install a OS and configure progs and things and you add freeze ups to such tasks you get a corrupted or flaky enviro 


could you swallow the red pill (the movie = Matrix) / erase your drive and perfrom a "clean install" with Sp-2 ??????

what bios are your running ?????? the most current 

if you select any of this / please dont begin until we discuss indepthly


hmmm / thats a rather sweeping MS message / what they are really say is 

1: somethings wrong with your system 
2: ?????????
3: ?????????
4: ????????


regards

joe


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## LucidEsquire (Oct 13, 2005)

LOL on the MS, yeah we love them don't we?

It is clean install just before started this forum, 2nd one actually to try and rectify this problem. But that was before the new PSU if it makes any difference?

The System ID: 4609 has various forums going on it, the easiest fix suggested was remove messenger 7.1 but I run 7.5 so there goes that, the other recommends the following. The reboot is fairly common all of a sudden...and the post I found seems to make sense but it didn't change anything.
--------------------------------------
"I've been seeing a particular problem on certain Windows XP computers when they are updated to Service Pack 2, and judging from posts in these newsgroups and also on other Internet message boards, it's quite a common problem. The symptoms are that after SP2 has been installed, and the machine has been rebooted a few times, this error message appears in the Application Event log. 
I searched information on this problem for a while, and eventually found the following two articles relating to Windows 2000 Service Pack 4: M821546 and M827664. It turns out that in Windows 2000 Service Pack 4 two new user rights were added, "Impersonate a client after authentication" (SeImpersonatePrivilege) and "Create Global Objects" (SeCreateGlobalPrivilege). Even though the articles do not say so, it seems that they were also added in Windows XP Service Pack 2. However, it seems that sometimes something goes wrong in the XP SP2 installer when it sets up these two new user rights. I think this is why some computers get the above error messages. It does not happen all the time and I cannot see any reason to which some computers are messed up and some ones are not. I reckon it is a race condition or some other similar bug in the installer. 
The reason that the problem does not always manifest itself straight away is probably because by default Windows only “refreshes” its security settings every 16 hours, and if that refresh is a while away you might not see the problem right away. Some networks may also have turned up this refresh time, so the problem is even worse. 
Some sites may also have these settings set (possibly incorrectly) in their Default Domain Policy group policy, which could also mess things up. However, at my site we don’t have these settings set on the domain anywhere, only in the Local Security Settings, and yet we still have the problem. Anyway, if the security settings upgrade goes wrong, you end up with the error. Fortunately, it seems to be quite easy to fix. 
On the affected workstation: 
1) Go to Start -> Settings -> Control Panel -> Administrative Tools. 
2) Run “Local Security Policy”. 
3) Go to Security Settings -> Local Policies -> User Rights Assignments. 
4) Double click on “Create global objects”. The correct default settings are “Administrators”, “INTERACTIVE”, and “SERVICE”. 
5) Double click on ''Impersonate a client after authentication''. The correct default settings are “Administrators”, “ASPNET” (if you have the .NET Framework installed) and “SERVICE”. 
Even if the settings are set correctly, you may need to “refresh” them to fix the problem. To do this, on each policy, remove one of the entries (“SERVICE” is probably the best to remove), then press OK to save the changes, and then go back in and add it back in again (click “Add User or Group...”, type “SERVICE” into the white box, and press OK). Then close the Local Security Settings box and reboot. If you are running in a domain with Group Policy, you might want to force a group policy refresh before you reboot by running “gpupdate /force”.
---------------------------------------------

The BIOS is 1008 from the ASUS website and is non beta


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## Barry_R (Aug 6, 2005)

This seems to be related to your video setup. Have you tried reinstalling the drivers or using a different version of your drivers?

If you try different versions make sure you used drive cleaner software to completely remove the old drivers before installing new ones.


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## LucidEsquire (Oct 13, 2005)

Yeah went through several driver revisiions starting at original when did clean OS install


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## LucidEsquire (Oct 13, 2005)

The way it stands now is:

It BSODed and rebooted three times in quick sucession, with no apparent trigger, yet again. At the moment am getting hour or so streches out of it. When it does crash the event viewer shows system ID 4609.

I just don't get it, it was fine for almost a day and then pow! down she goes. I've checked for viruses, spyware and the like with several different programs all clean. Registry fine too.

If need to will start fresh. AGAIN!

What are the chances that it is a MoBo fault or worse CPU fault?

Before I do the big wipe, will replace GPU to see if any change in system problem. Will post any findings.


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## linderman (May 20, 2005)

I think if it were a cpu fault it would show some temp variations or voltage fluctuations / same thing with the mobo / at this time I am starting to think software hickup


keep us posted


regards

joe


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## Barry_R (Aug 6, 2005)

Does it lockup if you run it in safemode for a while?


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## linderman (May 20, 2005)

The SP-2 problem is a well known bug / we had two office Dell's that went thru some bizarre behavior as a result of the sp-2 install as an add on.


Thats why if you are willing ? I will walk you thru the steps to add SP-2 to a WIN XP operating system disk / the end result is / you will have sp-2 added right to your win xp install cd / this is called slipstreaming ~~ nothing new just really NICE / when the OS installs just like normal only sp-2 will already be intergrated into the install rather than an add on "patch"

this is how we cured our two flaky dells'


all you need to accomplish this / is a computer that can connect to the internet and a cd-rom burner to do the "bootable burning"

its worth a shot 

here is a link explaining the "how to & why for's" but I have an easier way then their method
http://www.theeldergeek.com/slipstreamed_xpsp2_cd.htm

joe


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## LucidEsquire (Oct 13, 2005)

I need to do it and fast, this problem is starting to cost me. I need the PC up and running trouble free ASAP. I will have a look for some instructions to do this (no Link) Let me know of your method.


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## linderman (May 20, 2005)

Lucid:

sorry for the link blunder / i think my brain is starting to do auto shutdowns


joe


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## LucidEsquire (Oct 13, 2005)

Ok, that seems pretty straight forward. Do I need a alternative PC than the one with the discussed problems to perform these operations?

What is your method?

Once I have created this slipstreamed OS and started again with fresh format, is there any particular program order you would recommend to follow.

Initially I require:

TrendMicro internet security 2005
Modem drivers
ISP software

What drivers should I do first? Latest chipset and GPU driver?


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## linderman (May 20, 2005)

this 
Yes / i suggest you use an alternate PC / one thats stable / and one with a cd burner

here goes download auto streamer version 1.03
http://www.majorgeeks.com/download4444.html


then download service pack -2 to a folder on your "c" drive / its own folder is best / make sure to pick the "network version of Sp-2 or multiple computer version" because this is needed in order to get SP-2 into a folder / if you select the version for one computer it wont go into a folder / instead it will intergrate directly into windows
scroll down the web page / this is the one you need
*Download and Deploy Service Pack 2 to Multiple Computers*

"Download this version of Windows XP SP2 if you need to deploy it to multiple computers over a network"
http://www.microsoft.com/technet/prodtechnol/winxppro/maintain/winxpsp2.mspx


afterwards its damn easy / open autostreamer / it will ask you to for the source of windows XP and also where the source of the SP-2 are 
the source of the Win XP OS disk can stay in the cd-rom drive / the SP-2 you will have downloaded to a folder - get it to navigate to the folder / thats pretty much it dude >>>> after you push the button to do it / when its done it will make a file as you name it >> like "win xp-2 

once you see the file that it created after making the intergrated "new" version / you simply click on that little file icon / your cd burner program should take over from there and make you a "bootable" win xp-with SP-2 on it


also download this free prog / for erasing the drive / we dont want to take any chances that old crappy win OS files will be left behind to hinder a new install / this eraser prog will make the drive just like the day you took it out of the box - VERY empty
http://dban.sourceforge.net/ >>>>> download floppy version / then use the automode from the console / its an easy prog to use but takes a long time / start this on the trouble machine first / then go slipstream service pack 2


now thats pretty much it / the rest will be exactly like the first time you installed windows / no difference

you will need your drivers (sata) and video drivers / cable modem drivers / mobo chipset drivers 

I would load drivers in the following order

1) press F6 during windows install and load sata controller drivers
2) load video card drivers
3) motherboard chipset drivers >>>> not the instel raid accelerator if your mobo has that ??????? the chipset drivers for your mobo should be an .inf driver ????? i am not real current with your exact board
4) look for yellow exclamation marks in the device manager / if you see any load the drivers for them ? except any that are RAID based
5) you may have to enter bios and disable Raid controller if it keeps nagging that promise bios didnt load or some crap similar ?????

let me know how goes your assembling of this info and preperations / i will check on you often / if needed I would be willing to give you my home phone in a email or PM me from within this forum

goodluck / GO SLOW and read throughly this is not a rush thing / if you have any drives you dont want erased during the use of DBAN unplug the power plug to that drive and leave it off untill we are COMPLETLY done the whole OS reinstall process with drivers 

http://dban.sourceforge.net/


joe


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## LucidEsquire (Oct 13, 2005)

I have slipstreamed SP2 and all seems ok. Just one query I started performing it the way your link said to, i.e start by copying the XP disc to folder on HD. It almost completed and then said didn't have access to one file and stoped. I had all the files and such allowed and viewable via the folder options. Is this a problem with my XP disc or not worth worring about seeing as autostreamer worked fine.

I downloaded the HD eraser prog-the CD version as don't have floppy-burnt the image and all good. Stuck it in and started the long process, your right it is slow! Was going along good but stalled at 80% (1:42 hours in) the clock stoped and all. I thought it might be a HD fault?????

Anyways I had another HD Maxtor 30.9GB baracuda II. It ran through that fine, with a lot of noise....NOT GOOD....did the XP install with newly created disc. That's where that one stands. Not too happy to use it though it sounded terrible!

Thought I might give the original one another go, smae thing at 80% stopped! Am now trying a different wipe...the single pass all zero one... see if it makes it through. What do you think. HD kaput? Let you know if gets through this pass.


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## linderman (May 20, 2005)

I think I confused you with the slipstream process / the SP-2 goes into a folder / the WIN XP OS disk stays in your cd-rom tray while it makes the new OS disk-file ??????? hmmm hope it works the way you did that ?????? dont know never tried it in that manner ?????


sounds like Maxtor is going for the grave / no surprised they are REAL junk !!!!!

well tell you what we can do / you may like this  youre due for some good news !!!


after you have completed the OS install drivers and all etc on your old drive / try zero filling the drive again 

if successful we can go to xxclone.com and (free trial period) and test drive a cloning prog / its damn easy and it will clone you new install over to the stubborn drive / you WIll never notice the diff between the two / faster than the whole install again with drivers and such ??????

i'll be here / fire away with the questions

joe


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## linderman (May 20, 2005)

I would try downloading the manufacturer's hard drive diagnostic utility for the new stubborn drive / make sure its physically healthy ????



joe


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## LucidEsquire (Oct 13, 2005)

I only started doing that copy way I described above before I read your post and the easier way. Followed your instruction to the tee, worked a treat!

The stubborn drive has zero filled (knock wood), just went past that 80% mark. The first two times I tried erasing with that program it was set on the default option, it was doing three passes ( I think when I went into the options to select zero fill, they describe it as some department of defence criterion).

Now that hopefully it has zero filled completely should I try again with the other option? Or just continue on the baracuda with drivers and then give the cloning a go, seeing as it's zero fillled.


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## linderman (May 20, 2005)

hmmmm:


seeing as how the drivers arent installed on the baracuda / I would go for the clean install of the other drive 

especially seeing as how the "other" drive isnt formatted or partitioned yet ????


its really 6 of one / half dozen of the other ???????? no real clear winner time saver at this point / my vote >>> install winxp-sp-2 install to the "other' drive


joe


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## linderman (May 20, 2005)

also another quick note

I never "gang" load drivers / always install one driver at a time / always complete shutdowns between NEVER RESTARTS

joe


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## LucidEsquire (Oct 13, 2005)

Ok all done...what a mission

I guess I will install some prgrams and hope for the best. Tommorrow whould be fine but whether it holds out for longer than that is yet to be seen.

I'll let you know.

Once again I'd like to thank you for you invaluable help and great advice!


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## linderman (May 20, 2005)

Lucid:

happy to hear you have progressed to where you are !!

I would consider some isolation when installing progs / install your progs slowly so you have a "chance" to find out the culprit if it happens again / I would load any microsoft products you may use / word, excel, adobe/ any anti virus maker progs etc / save any third party not super popular stuff for last (spyware progs) / if you run any such lesser know progs / this will give you a chance to learn what is the culprit if one pops out !!

same thing with updates and software installs / one at a time and complete shutdowns not re-starts

how about bios version ????? are you running the latest ?????


regards

joe


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## LucidEsquire (Oct 13, 2005)

Holding up alright, hasn't faulted yet.

Yeah got latest bios.

I'll keep you informed as I go, taking it easy until I get these projects done then I'll push it.


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## linderman (May 20, 2005)

taking it easy is a very smart move / keep me posted 

after it proves it self stavble for a couple of days add more software prog by prog until you have all you want loaded / then push the snot out of it and see what you have ????



joe


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## LucidEsquire (Oct 13, 2005)

well that was short [email protected] it!

I had installed my tuner card...Leadtek DTV1000T...seemed ok
and
Installed messenger 7.5

I had however created restore points so that's where I'm at now prior to both those installations.

Will keep working and let you know if happens again

The event viewer:
applications:
The COM+ Event System detected a bad return code during its internal processing. HRESULT was C0000005 from line 44 of d:\qxp_slp\com\com1x\src\events\tier1\eventsystemobj.cpp. Please contact Microsoft Product Support Services to report this error.

which is that same 4906 event ID

system:
The WFIOCTL service failed to start due to the following error: 
The system cannot find the file specified. 

which has a event ID of 7000


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## LucidEsquire (Oct 13, 2005)

Ok seems to be stable again....could be a while before does again. I did not have the tuner card in last time when was origninally experiencing problems but did have messenger installed.

By my amazing powers of deduction I would conclude that this was the cause...only time will tell.

Damn MS....rock on Linux


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## linderman (May 20, 2005)

well at least you know its one of the two !! I will put my money on the tuner as it needs drivers >>> if i am correct ?

awesome move on the restore point >>> three attaboys recorded !!

you may want to clone what you have now over to the other drive as a back-up
use xxclone.com its super easy to use and all windows GUI
simply sign up for a test drive (free 30 day period) then download the prog / when you open the prog there are only two windows to interact with / amin window has you select your target drive the other the source drive / then there is an *advanced button * on the lower right of same console / click the advanced button and put a check mark into the three bootable options 
like >>>> boot.ini boot something???? write MBR ?????

that it / then you have a super dooper crash that wont restore you will be able to get back to what you have at this moment


will wait to hear / I would call MS and report the error / man I am glad that phone call isnt by me / thats a ton of elevator music ** (call holding)


joe


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## LucidEsquire (Oct 13, 2005)

Ok....Cloned.

Works well apart from the noise....I'll have to get new drive when have everything working A1. So far no more crashes. Will try messenge again later, easier than Tuner card ( it has got to have the slowest installation program I have ever seen ) I have tested the new drive (that's what I'm on now) working well.

When I come to settling on a setup that works...I would like to get some SATA drives, I've never used them. Can you recommend I link to give me a good head start when it comes to setting them up?


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## LucidEsquire (Oct 13, 2005)

Now its gotten weird again????

Just crashed but nothing in event viewer!!! What the?

BSOD then reboot...Any ideas now? Will let you know when does again. At least its not as frequent as was before. Can actually get some **** done.


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## linderman (May 20, 2005)

well this one is certainly giving us a run for the money !!

do you have a different gfx card you could try ?????

the sata drives arent that bad to set up / i can walk you thru it / they can be flaky as I am sure you have seen all the problem posts on here 

I would leave a monitoring program running at all times so you can constantly be checking temps of the video card


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## LucidEsquire (Oct 13, 2005)

I did have...gave it back today...didn't get time to try it. The graphics card I have is one of the 8 or so recommended for the deluxe version of this board...which by the way had no problems. Don't know why I changed now. That and the fact that I have monitored it and it doesn't go over 43 deg (when I had last install going) leads me to think it is something else. I will however run the monitoring program again on this installation and keep an eye on it.

I am pretty tied up with work for the next few days so can't give that a go till then. Well that is provided I only get a 'crash' very infrequently. Would you do a fresh start with this card or change over suffice?

Is it possible that despite memtest86 showing no errors that it may be a RAM capatability issue? Once again I had no probs with this RAM on the deluxe but Legend is not exactly high end stuff.


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## LucidEsquire (Oct 13, 2005)

I'll see when can get it back though, won't take to long and will rule out another possible.


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## linderman (May 20, 2005)

Well memory compatability is certainly worth looking at ????

I am not sure if you can have uncompatilbe memory and it wont show up as a flaw in memtest ?????

I have learned a long time ago (the hard way ofcourse) crucial & OCZ onely for me / I have never yet had a memory problem with these brands when using the models the told me to use (memory configurator) I have had plenty of memory freaks using other brands , especially the cheaper stuff

well the most important thing is to get your work done !! hopefully it wont interfere with you making a living ????

as far a video driver goes / i think a regular removal of the existing driver / then shutdown and re-boot / add new driver / shut down & re-boot should suffice when swapping cards ?????

as long as you dont use the soft boot I think your chances of sucess will improve / my brother used to be in a habit of uninsatalling a video card driver / install a new driver all in the same session then soft boot / well after he has reformatted his drive enough and reloaded windows he finally stopped that !!! * * 

joe

joe


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## linderman (May 20, 2005)

just to be on the safe side run memtest86 all nite long and see what that turns up ??????


joe


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## linderman (May 20, 2005)

Lucid:

I have just been advised by one of our Guru's in here to swap out and try another CPU if possible / AMD processors do not have on die thermal protection / so if the old PSU or other problem heated up the CPU for any length of time / it may have damaged your CPU ???? 

I got my fingers crossed / but you know murphy's law as well as I do ???


crossed fingers / hoping its memory

joe


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## LucidEsquire (Oct 13, 2005)

Will run mem86 when call it quits tonite.

Hope it is not CPU...should still be under warranty...see how that pans out if need be...could be tricky and expensive.

Will be talking to my supplier tomorrow and hopefully arranging different RAM try diff CPU and GPU if necessary.

Just out of curiosty...cause can't find consistent info anywhere...what is temperature would be damaging? they are rated for up to 74 deg or something like that not that I would ever want to run it at those temps!!! The whole operation of this PC has been monitored with asus probe and never exceeded 60 deg, which was with the old deluxe board and never saw any problems. Will check though.

Back to the mem...I have not been able to find compatability data for my RAM and this board. It's not in the list in the manual and net has no info on combo. Will endevor to get better stuff on the way tomorrow...OCZ probably.

The crashes now are few and far inbetween and only seem to happen after running models that process great number of variables, then opening another program just shuts it down. Event viewer still shows nothing.


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## linderman (May 20, 2005)

damaging temps for your cpu would be above the mid 70's C

you havent seen them go above 60C / thats super as far as not expectign to see cpu damage

OCZ does not even list your board in the memory configurator / so as such ? i would assume your board is a bit finicky about it memory !! thats good news !!

crucial however does list memory for your board
http://www.crucial.com/store/MParts...7304&WSMD=A8N-SLI+Premium&WSPN=CT2KIT6472Z40B

you could take this model number and search on ebay 

regards 

I would not heistate to obatin the crucial memory . you can sell off your existign sticks on ebay

joe


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## LucidEsquire (Oct 13, 2005)

To what advantage would you see in getting some of the ballistixs range from crucial. I'm not that clued up on mem, understand CAS latencey and lower the better. But thats about it. If later on I really wnat to push this system is the little extra warranted. And also two matched pairs to give 2Gb be ok (obviously would keep each pair to the same colour in the slots on mobo)


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## linderman (May 20, 2005)

Lucid:

The added advantage of the Ballistix memory is over rated if you ask me. Its a really necessary componet if you want to get into serious overclocking ???
the lower the Cas Latency and quality of the memory chips themselves the faster you can tweak and push the memory timings.

However / overclocking in my opinion is a complete waste of money in todays systems / back in the day (late nineties) when the processor was the hold-up (p-166 & P-233 >>>> whewww old stuff and even some of the P2's) overclocking made noticable and wanted changes / especially when operating systems could handle more memory (win 95 choked on 512mb memory) win 98 gets weird beyond one gig !!

Todays system's are going so much faster the bottlenecks are no longer at the CPU or at the memory stick / the bottleneck at this time is in the 32 bit PCI bridge / the next big speed boost is when 64 bit OS's are REALLY running at the 64bit performance and you HAVE software capable of running efficiently at 64 bits / that is still a ways off / yes there are 64 bit OS's and 64 bit mobo's but there arent any real quantity of 64 bit efficient hardware or software to speak of / until there is more software to utilize the 64 bit capabilities then its a waste of money to invest in that capability. Windows 64 bit Longhorn OS has a decent chance of making that happen / but its still aways out.

In summary / I have spent wasted fortunes chasing overclocking goals, water coolers are needed to really ramps things up to an impressive goal / like 20% and above. You wont notice any difference in real world use / if you enjoy staring at benchmarks to see if the beating you are putting on your componets is making them faster / then by all means but I have retired from that foolish chase / I have burnt up way too much $$$$ in cpu's / motherboards / memory / video cards etc 

its your call / but I personally am running CAS 3 crucial memory right now / I swapped out some memory with a friend that I had which was CAS 2.5 / I can see no diff / but he is still chasing the over clock fad >>> but he is novice that just wants to make computer "talk" >> he is at this moment trying to figure out how to combat the condensation inside the motherboard from his CPU water cooler * LOL*


The trick to buying computer parts and systems is NEVER buy what you dont need NOW or within the immediate next 6 months as far as performance goes / you set-up is againg before it even gets shipped to you / who cares ???? Is it capable of doing what you want it to do ~~ fast enough so youre not impatiently waiting on it ???????

As far as amount of memory goes / there are gamers that swear that 2 gis is better than one gig and you can see the diff ????? I am from missourri (the show me state) I say show me the diff ????????

2 gigs / yeah maybe if youre not on a budget for your system ???? beyond two gigs is a waste I would much rather have a Western Digital Raptor Sata drive with one gig of memory / than I would to have two gigs and an IDE boot drive ???????

regards

joe


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## LucidEsquire (Oct 13, 2005)

All makes sense to me not much I can say really...you have said it all I will be making a purchase some time today (Aus) and let you know. I don't think there are any suppliers of crucial here as I keep getting redirected to the US site. Might be bit of wait but can bare it. In the mean time found something that made me laugh...got to now.

". Is BSOD a bug, or a tradition?
According to definition, a bug is a part of program that is not working correctly. Despite so many versions of windows, BSOD still exists so it's a useful feature. The bugs are scattered quite liberally in most of Microsoft's operating systems, so the BSOD, an error reporting system as well as an end to all your current work is in fact a feature. What would it be, if we had no BSOD? It would only cause confusion and chaos, because Windows, without a Blue Screen just is not old good Windows. Your machine would just die with no explanation. A BSOD is like the rolling of the credits at the end of a movie, you know it's The End."

Let you know the verdict on the mem as soon as I do


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## Barry_R (Aug 6, 2005)

Darn, Does that mean that I have a dog with my 1 gig of Corsair Twinx and my cheap Maxtor 7200 RPM IDE drive? :rippedhan

:hijacked:


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## linderman (May 20, 2005)

Barry youre a wise [email protected]#$%^&*() * LOL*

one gig = dog / not hardly !!

these guys sure do keep my feet to the fire !!!


BSOD is like the credits in a movie >>> you know its the end !! boy oh boy !! isnt that the truth and I never thought about it quite like that they way they just keep bringing the ole BSOD forward / gosh I hope Longhorn has it too !! what would we do without it ?????? LOL


cheers 

joe


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## common (Oct 18, 2005)

man maybe this is way too basic and i think it has been mentioned,

before the clean install, i would default the motherboard, then do the install of windows , then FOR SURE install motherboard drivers !!! FOR SURE !! no yellow question marks !!


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## linderman (May 20, 2005)

hmmm / food for thought I will try that in the future



thanks / common


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## LucidEsquire (Oct 13, 2005)

RAM news...spoke with supplier he has already organiased some other RAM which he claims is better than corsair, didn't get the brand name(bad connection). Sounds free of charge so will give it a go first, but will more than likely get the crucial anyway...get more for his replacements on ebay i'm hoping anyways. Let you know how it goes.

RE: memtest didn't run as did allnighter am running it tonite and will post results and any developements on replacement RAM.


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## linderman (May 20, 2005)

Lucid:

good news that vendor will swap your ram / most wont swap for compatability issues !!

keep me posted


joe


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## LucidEsquire (Oct 13, 2005)

memtest results:
4 hours 6 passes = no errors

BSOD reports 0x0000008e = memory issues so here's hoping it will be fixed when get it.


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## linderman (May 20, 2005)

fingers are crossed


>>>>> http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;en-us;827663




joe


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## LucidEsquire (Oct 13, 2005)

Have just put in new RAM - Patriot PC3200 DDR400 1GB(2x512) Dual Channel

It is running a lot smoother for general application....amazing...has been stable as yet but only just starte with it.
Had a loo for some info on it. people seem to be pleased with it but definitely not for OC, by all reports anyway.
Will see how performs over next couple of days...if proves stable or at least marked improvement will be putting order in for Crucial.

Will keep you informed


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## linderman (May 20, 2005)

Lucid:

Patriot is quality ram / has a proven record of smooth performance. Your sources are correct / Patriot is not a favored memory for OC'ers, but then again you know my opinion of the practical need of OC'ing.

Give me a smooth stable running spec system any day !!



regards

joe


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## LucidEsquire (Oct 13, 2005)

Well its been going great guns...finally hurah! hurah!
Since I put it in not one crash or freeze, have been performing more than what could before, 20+ windows open over 2 screens models and programs running no drama! Time will tell...but if its held up so far should be promising. I'll keep some updates going over next few days.

I don't want to OC the mem at all, but CPU maybe its at 2200 now and I know it maxz out at 3700 not that I would want to push it to those boundaries. Just a little tweek, enough so that a quality heat sink and fan can keep it cool without any possible problems. Will be a way off if can ever find the time to play around with it.

Thanks again for all the support don't know what would have done without it...one of those funny white coats would have probably been in order.

Important note...DEFINITELY DON'T SKIMP ON RAM...not worth the hassels thats for sure


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## linderman (May 20, 2005)

Lucid:

We have all learned the same lesson / dont skimp on RAM or PSU's !!!!! they will come back to bite yur butt every time !!

if & when you want to overclock(5 & 10 % is no sweat >> 20% and more gets real touchy!!) / you will need ram sticks capable of tighter memory tweakings (*OCZ ballastix* or Some cream of the crop crucial sticks) / you cant really just overclock the CPU / the OCing is a combo effort of ram and CPU. goodluck and keep us posted. Sounds very promising !!!!!


cheers 

joe


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## LucidEsquire (Oct 13, 2005)

Hasn't misssed a beat for two days solid bashing now, am very happy and relieved. Will look into the OCing but finding time is the problem.


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## linderman (May 20, 2005)

Lucid :

I think your outta the woods !!

sounds like you have achieved a darn nice build with stability !!


congrats 


joe


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