# MSI gt780dxr Charger causing random shutdown



## TryHard (Feb 3, 2014)

Hi, 6 months ago I bought a used msi gt780dxr gaming laptop

A week ago my laptop suddenly shutdown with around 2 second cooldown before I was able to restart it. It then started to become more frequent around 3 hours after startup. Now it's about 15 minutes yet it stay extremely random can happens after 30 sec and sometime it seems solved. 

I read every forum topics about the same problem on the same laptop and someone said it might be because of the AC charger saying that the problem disappears when unplugged and running only on the battery. I tried that and haven't got a shutdown yet (1 day) yet this can't be a permanent solution since I am a gamer and I need my laptop at full power

What have been tried:

-Total fan clean up and thermal compound replacement ( I followed the How to youtube video about the MSI gt780dxr overheating problem)
I am 100% sure that overheating isnt the problem since the shutdown happens even when i am not gaming

-Updating Bios (got the 10h version made for the exact laptop from msi website, I took the non-raid version since I installed an ssd on my laptop) the shutdown also happened once while I was on the bios setup menu so it's not related in anyway to windows or any other software or virus

People of internet with infinite wisdom, I shall seek your help to guide me on my quest to solve my problem.


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## joeten (Dec 4, 2008)

Hi and welcome to TSF test the ram with memtest 86 + if only yo discount it as a possible source of the issue Guide to using Memtest86+ - Geeks to Go Forums


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## TryHard (Feb 3, 2014)

Before i start the test, do you really think it could be a Ram problem?
The shutdown occurs randomly independently of my Ram usage at the moment. 
And a ram failure would probably cause some kind of blue screen crash not an instant shutdown. 

When the shutdown occurs everything stops (fan , led keyboard, every light) then most of the time it restarts automatic, when it doesn't it shutsdown second after i try to restart it. 
For some period of time the problem seems to stop but when it comes back, the shutdowns become more and more frequent.

I would prefer your taughts on that before actually testing all my Ram chips one by one.


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## joeten (Dec 4, 2008)

Random shut downs can be a number of things we have to start somewhere and the ram is as good a place as any also checking the heatsink and fan are properly and firmly seated,cleaning out dust and debris,power supply, the list goes on.


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## TryHard (Feb 3, 2014)

I did the entire test and no error was found and the CPU temp stayed around 65C 
Also I already did a full fan and cooler clean up, there is no dust and the fan is well seated, i double checked


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## joeten (Dec 4, 2008)

Hi good lets see how things are when your doing something intensive please download and run this then play a game or run your anti virus HWMonitor CPUID - System & hardware benchmark, monitoring, reporting post some screen shots of the temps and voltages


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## ShadeO89 (Jul 20, 2013)

I have this exact same computer, problem and conditions for the random shutdowns. I have done some stresstesting with FurMark and games like BF3 and Warthunder and have gotten this HWMonitor slate: 

http://i.imgur.com/1wmFp0X.png

Not to hijack the thread but as our problems are identical i felt like contributing info to try to solve this


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## joeten (Dec 4, 2008)

Did you clean out the air vents and fan with some canned compressed air


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## ShadeO89 (Jul 20, 2013)

No i haven't used a compressed can, but I have cleaned them with water (as they are totally detachable) and "scraped" the blades of the fan clean, and the temperatures aren't that high are they?


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## joeten (Dec 4, 2008)

It is not advisable to use water isopropyl alcohol is safer, and it is always good to clean the vents and fan regularly to stop dust and debris building up inside,heat is usually the biggest contributor to sudden shut downs so it is a good maintenance procedure.


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## ShadeO89 (Jul 20, 2013)

Yeah i know about the water, but i think that isopropyl would have done less of 

an impact on dust and debris being actually stuck in the "grills" and vents, and I 

regularly do maintnenance on my system, but do you think that i was running 

with high temps?


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## joeten (Dec 4, 2008)

Not to much but there are odd highs in the 3rd line of temps


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## ShadeO89 (Jul 20, 2013)

What would the THRM be? As in hardware?


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## joeten (Dec 4, 2008)

I believe it is the ACPI thermal zone


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## ShadeO89 (Jul 20, 2013)

But that only tells us about a specfic zone that is controlled by the chipset if I have understood it correctly?

Quote from given tech forum: "Chips used for things like fan control have an internal structure that allows them to be set up so that zone 1 might be ram+cache, zone 2 cpu, zone 3 video card. Pretty much the way you can divide a home into zones for heating and cooling. "


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## ShadeO89 (Jul 20, 2013)

So basically we are seeing some unusual high temps on the motherboard chipset


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## joeten (Dec 4, 2008)

I may be being a tad cautious I just don't like anomalies,however the other temps appear ok it may be a board issue around the dc jack


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## Rich-M (May 2, 2007)

Rather impressive laptop but if not temp issue then I would be looking at hard drive as that is pretty high powered as many BSOD's come from them either getting too hot or corrupted sectors landed on. Has the hard drive been replaced at all?


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## ShadeO89 (Jul 20, 2013)

TWICE! so yeah, my first HDD died from a "knock" and i had a production malfunction on the second so i have just installed an 250gb samsung 840 evo SSD on it, but everything seems to be running as it should besides me having to Upgrade (from home basic to home prem) and activate Win7 (gonna do that later tonight)

EDIT: and the Drive temps seem fine as well so...

EDIT2: there is both an HDD and an SSD installed on it currently


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## TryHard (Feb 3, 2014)

Same here I switched one of the HDD by an SSD a long time ago and I never had this problem until recently. The shutdowns seems to be way more random then I taught I have been trying to find how to make it less or more frequent to find the cause and still nothing. It stills shutsdown when its unplugged, when the problem occurs if happens again in short period of time while the problem can stop for an entire day. When it shutsdown it always reopens by itself after 3-6 seconds.
Also my HWMonitor seems to be fine :

Hardware Monitors
-------------------------------------------------------------------------

Hardware monitor	ACPI
Temperature 0	28°C (82°F) [0xBC2] (TZ00)
Temperature 1	30°C (85°F) [0xBD6] (TZ01)
Temperature 2	44°C (111°F) [0xC64] (THRM)

Hardware monitor	Battery
Voltage 0	12.45 Volts [0x30A2] (Current Voltage)
Capacity 0	86580 mWh [0x15234] (Designed Capacity)
Capacity 1	55622 mWh [0xD946] (Full Charge Capacity)
Capacity 2	55622 mWh [0xD946] (Current Capacity)
Level 0 36 pc [0x40] (Wear Level)
Level 1 100 pc [0x64] (Charge Level)

Hardware monitor	NVIDIA NVAPI
Voltage 0	0.85 Volts [0x352] (VIN0)
Temperature 0	43°C (109°F) [0x2B] (TMPIN0)


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## Kladmajster (Aug 19, 2014)

Hello, I have exactly the same problem, with the same MSI laptop (maybe just few specs are different)
but the problem is very similar...I expect random shutoffs and I am starting to be afraid, that they gonna ruin something more in my PC...
as you said, they are completely random, but I managed to close it up to having lot of apps open, or changing from game app back to windows,
but sometimes it shutsoff just randomly without any pattern. 
I also tried to clean it, apply new thermal compound, reinstal OS, but the problem came back after a short delay and now it seems to be more frequent...

have you found out any solution to it yet ? I read lots of stuff, that its because of the adapter getting old and causing power spikes which shut it off, but then I read that replacing it didnt helped one guy...
I really dont know what else to do, since warranty worn out just close before of this issue ...

thank you, if this thread is not dead, for any replies


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## joeten (Dec 4, 2008)

Have you tested the hard drive and ram


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## Kladmajster (Aug 19, 2014)

yes I tested RAM and no problem
Dont know how to test HDD, but I think its not the issue either
Is exactly as TryHard commented about his problem

As I was going through internet I found out 2 possibilities:
one is the adapter/power problem somewhere along the circuit
or the other is dying GPU...but I dont understand how that could be happening and causing these random shut downs...
but I will be glad for any guidance

thank you


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## joeten (Dec 4, 2008)

A poorly working Ac adapter can be tested with a multimeter How to Test an AC Adapter with a Volt/Multi-Meter
Testing a hard drive can be done with this SeaTools for DOS tutorial
Do those first then we can consider the gpu problem


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## ShadeO89 (Jul 20, 2013)

Hi guys. I have a solution to my original problem (though to some itmay be a disheartening one). I found out that it was my videocard(GPU) that was dying, had a new one installed, now everything works as intended. Hope you'll get your problem fixed.


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## joeten (Dec 4, 2008)

Thanks for posting back with your solution.


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## ShadeO89 (Jul 20, 2013)

I would expect everyone to do the same. Else a techforum would be useless

Cheers!


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## Rich-M (May 2, 2007)

ShadeO89 said:


> I would expect everyone to do the same. Else a techforum would be useless
> 
> Cheers!


Yes we couldn't agree more but you would be amazed how many do not!


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## Kladmajster (Aug 19, 2014)

hmm...seems like the info I found on the net is true then, that it is the GPU unit,
however, can someone pls explain this to me, how such thing can cause these random shutdowns (idle state or during 3D app) ?

and Shade089
can you pls let me know on where and how to get a new GPU ?
or maybe if it is possible to order another (newer/more powerful) model ?

and thank you again


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## joeten (Dec 4, 2008)

Overheating can cause the system to shutdown this is usually a normal reaction and is done to try to save further damage, However, in some cases the overheating can cause damage for instance if the gpu is part of the motherboard the overheating can affect the solder around the gpu causing it to become detached.


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## Kladmajster (Aug 19, 2014)

This is certainly not an overheating issue, as I changed thermal compound just recently and watching HWmonitor, temps never go above 60 on GPU
or anywhere else ...
But can faulty GPU shut down whole PC on its own ? I thought there should be some BSOD, or graphical artefacts, not just a crude shut down/turn on issue...
Now I am pretty much sure, the reason is the GPU, since during 3D applications I have much higher tendency to see this shut down (last time I even encountered some graphical green glitch just 1s prior to shut down)...but why it shuts down sometimes also in idle ?


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## joeten (Dec 4, 2008)

What did you change the thermal compound on as the spec shows the gpu as part of the motherboard MSI Global GT780DX(GT780DXR) if that chip is getting overly warm it can do what I described and in doing so would cause a shutdown since the connection would be broken.


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## Kladmajster (Aug 19, 2014)

hmm...
the GPU looks like this 
NVIDIA GeForce GTX 570M 1 5GB GDDR5 VRAM MXM 3 0B VGA Module | eBay

here you can see how to remove it (it has quite nice customizable options this laptop)
How to replace video card on a MSI GT780 Laptop - YouTube
so its not overheat, but something messing on with the whole GPU (most likely)

however now am I wondering, if its possible to upgrade it to 670m, since 670m has just slightly higher clocks than 570m, but should be the same mostly ?

since Ive seen, it can be done from 560m, 470m, or even 260m to 570m

moreover Ive read about upgrading to 580m, but then you need to install also better heat cooling equipment instead of the stock one
But I am interested in changing it 670m now, since the price is pretty much the same...


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## BIGBEARJEDI (Aug 8, 2012)

Kladmajster said:


> This is certainly not an overheating issue, as I changed thermal compound just recently and watching HWmonitor, temps never go above 60 on GPU
> or anywhere else ...
> But can faulty GPU shut down whole PC on its own ? I thought there should be some BSOD, or graphical artefacts, not just a crude shut down/turn on issue...
> _>>>If you go back and read the post, original OP had temps in excess of 100 deg C on his GPU temps; that's the temperature of boiling water!! It's also hot enough to melt and remelt solder joints on the Motherboard, especially the GPU chip joints as that's where most of the heat is coming from. Most modern laptops *don't know about MSI, as I've never seen one here in the U.S.* have internal curcuity that will do a hard shutdown to prevent runaway overtemping of the components (CPU, GPU, RAM, DMA, Hard Drive, etc.). This is what typically causes permanent damage to the components. You said your temps were 60 deg. C or under; but was that always the case? Are you sure you never had temps above 72 deg. C and 100 deg C? BSODs aren't always applicable to hardware failure; they tend to do a better job with software failures; hence the offending module(s) driver filenames are usually listed right on the BSOD. <<<_
> Now I am pretty much sure, the reason is the GPU, since during 3D applications I have much higher tendency to see this shut down (last time I even encountered some graphical green glitch just 1s prior to shut down)...but why it shuts down sometimes also in idle ?


_>>>Important to note also that laptops really aren't designed for online gaming. They will work, but overtemp damage is more common than doggie videos on YouTube. :grin: Even if you don't think your laptop is overheating, that doesn't preclude irreversable permanent damage to the internal circuitry from the stress that online Gaming puts on those components. IMO there are no laptops on the market and that includes MSI, Dell-Alienware, etc. that are properly designed to do this. Custom-built gaming desktops is the only answer to this. Period. There is much debate over this, and the laptop makers are making billions every year selling "*Gaming Laptops*" on the market. One thing for certain, and I've seen this myself, is that *ANY* prolonged use of your laptop for online Gaming will reduce the effective lifetime of your laptop by 50% :uhoh: So, even though Shade got his CPU replaced and he is back up and gaming again, his laptop will die 50% sooner than if we were using if for standard computer applications; MS Office, E-mail, Social Media, CAD, Internet browsing, Photoshop, etc.! :facepalm: Read through our forums, especially the *Gaming forum* and the *Hard Drive forum* and you'll see what I'm talking about. Laptops that are supposed to last for 5 years, die in 2-3 yrs. or have to have Mobos or GPU/CPU chips replaced way before their time. Some of my colleagues in our Gaming Forum disagree with this, and that's ok. But, the documented evidence on the Internet is staggering in support of what I am saying. So, once you resolve your hardware problem and that's most likely what it is, if you continue the online Gaming with your laptop, it's going to break down and die a lot sooner than you would have liked considering the amount of money you must have paid for that laptop.  Of course, you will weigh this evidence in light of your other research and experience and do what you want to do; I'm just pointing out what you are facing by insisting on doing online Gaming on a computer that wasn't properly designed for that application. :nonono: There are many users I know personally as well as the folks here on the Forum who have gone through 2 or even 3 "*Gaming Laptops*" and finally came to the epiphany that they were being had by the laptop makers; and switched to custom-built or high-performance "*Gaming desktops*", which have the real-estate, airflow, and design to handle the extreme high temps produced by online Gaming. In case you are interested, we have a build guide for making your own custom-gaming rig here: http://www.techsupportforum.com/forums/f255/tsf-hardware-teams-recommended-builds-2014-a-668661.html :nonono:<<<BIGBEARJEDI>>>_


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## joeten (Dec 4, 2008)

You might be able to I have not seen it done so cannot answer definitively, you should also check if a bios update would be required, At least you could replace with a similar card.


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## Kladmajster (Aug 19, 2014)

WoW, so much flame and hate against G laptops and online gaming 
Of course I am aware, that having a laptop used for mostly gaming is not the best thing to do, but still is a better option, if you have to travel the world more often, and dont have the needs to take all the things of desktop PC with you everytime...
I have to say, that I was stressing my laptop pretty much every day for 2 years with various games (not so much online though, and I dont think League of Legends is that much demanding game anyway)
So I must say I am not suprised how it has ended afterall. 
But I was mostly interested in narrowing this problem as much as possible by disscussing it with you guys and it seems that it helped...
The last thing is to decide whats the best option now...if to order new GPU for approx. 300USD and hope it will last for at least 1 year more
or get that cash flow and buy new laptop with higher specs and better CPU/GPU architecture in means of heating for approx. 2000 USD...

but anyway, thank you for your opinion


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## joeten (Dec 4, 2008)

I would not throw money at it as there will be better chips running faster and cooler on the way.


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## pashby (Jul 20, 2004)

Hi there
Had similar problem with my Asus.
Random shutdowns with no warning.
Found out it was the battery. Remove yours and run on mains and see if it happens. New battery fixed mine.
Peter


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## ShadeO89 (Jul 20, 2013)

[/QUOTE]and Shade089
can you pls let me know on where and how to get a new GPU ?
or maybe if it is possible to order another (newer/more powerful) model ?

and thank you again[/QUOTE]

[LOL, how to quote?]

Well I had the exact same idea to maybe upgrade my system, found out that it would most probably require a BIOS flash so scrapped that idea and just searched for the original GPU model. Searched high and lo for anyone who could provide me with a new unit that I might install myself (as it is pretty easy to do so on this laptop), but all I found were sketchy sellers on Ebay from china and the likes. It seems that the sales of GPU units are limited to service centers (probably some kind of deal between GPU manufacturer and laptop manufacturer to boost sales of new laptops) so I ended up taking it to my local MSI service center and they sent it to the nearest workshop to get it fixed. 

I was lucky enough that it went under warranty (even though I had done some thermal pasting etc.), so i suggest you search google for a MSI service center near you and then make a call. That at least is free of charge.

Best of luck


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## Kladmajster (Aug 19, 2014)

Pshby - 

this is certainly not a battery issue in this case, but thanks for your opinion

Shade089 - 

Hm, well that would be a problem for me, since my warranty finished just few months ago and the problem was not so serious at that time and I also though its a overheating problem, but then when it started to do again and quite more often I missed the chance to send it for warranty fix.
Nevertheless, MSI service centrum for my country is somehow strange, when I checked it for adress, for few countries around they have just one and that is in Poland and I am afraid of problematic dealing since I dont have warranty anymore...
I also found 2 possible sources on ebay, or directly from china, which would cost me approx. 300 USD with shipping...so this looks like its gonna be my last resort  I hope they wont send me some crap...


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## joeten (Dec 4, 2008)

I see them for sale on AliExpress but the warranty is limited, I also found it here NVIDIA GeForce GTX 560M MXM 3.0 DDR5 1.5GB video VGA Card dell MSI alienware | eBay
I cannot comment on either of the sellers as I have never used them.


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## BIGBEARJEDI (Aug 8, 2012)

Kladmajster said:


> WoW, so much flame and hate against G laptops and online gaming
> _>>>I just think it's awfully unfair of the laptop manufacturers taking advantage of unwary consumers and making Billion-dollar profits. I used to do online Gaming when it first came out, and I got my son started in it. I built him his first PC that he used almost exclusively for Gaming. 6 yrs. ago when I bought him a $1,300 Toshiba Qosmio top of the line Gaming laptop; I got firsthand knowledge of the design deficiencies of Gaming laptops!! In the first year, both the Motherboard and Hard Drive had to be replaced under warranty. In the 3rd year, the Motherboard had to replaced again, and we asked Best Buy why, and they said it had been used for excessive Gaming use. The Toshiba Tech who fixed it told the Best Buy Tech that! Back when we picked it up *2nd Mobo was replaced n/c under the 3 yr. extended warranty progam fortunately. There were also several other problems which we had to pay to get fixed included a new internal fan, and cd/dvd drive. All those problems happened within 5 yrs. Just about all brands of laptops, the majority of them will run for 5 yrs. on original parts, barring catastrophic failure of course. The Qosmio Mobo #3 finally died this February, not even 6 yrs. old, and according to Toshiba themselves, they claimed all the failures were due to excessive online Gaming use. Toshiba used to be #1 in laptops worldwide with a 79% market share; no longer, as their name has been severely damaged by marketing "Gaming Laptops" that fall appart in the first year!! :angry: I had to build my son a desktop, as he doesn't have the money to build his own custom-rig gaming desktop. He just does his gaming on Xbox console now, and doesn't even game on the desktop I built him. So, not mad at you or Gamers in general. <<<_
> Of course I am aware, that having a laptop used for mostly gaming is not the best thing to do, but still is a better option, if you have to travel the world more often, and dont have the needs to take all the things of desktop PC with you everytime...
> I have to say, that I was stressing my laptop pretty much every day for 2 years with various games (not so much online though, and I dont think League of Legends is that much demanding game anyway)
> ...


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## Kladmajster (Aug 19, 2014)

Hi guys....

So I ordered a new GPU exactly the same as my laptop had from eBay, took 2 weeks until it was delivered...the card looks nearly identical (just some differences in markings on some modules) to the one I had and has been dying for last few weeks (causing the infamous random shut-downs).
I changed them on my own, since its not that big deal when it comes to the mechanical work, applied thermal compound and assembled everything as it was before...
But now, when I start my laptop, the power starts, fan spins, but the screen is black and nothing is happening as if there is no VGA at all...

Do you think I should flash the bios, or something else needs to be done ?
Or the card I recieved is not compatible or I dont really know what to do...
thank you


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## joeten (Dec 4, 2008)

Test with a external monitor, reseat the card, you may not have gotten the correct card since you mention differences.


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## Kladmajster (Aug 19, 2014)

I got an answer from the selling company from eBay...

they said, that these cards have been used by Dell laptops and are not sure about the compatibility with a MSI (mine) laptop

so now I have 2 options:

Send it back and get a refund, altough shipping costs (which are high) are not returned

Or try to get miraculously some bios/vbios tweaking and maybe get it to work, however, I have no idea how to ...


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## joeten (Dec 4, 2008)

OK, take the refund, the chances of you finding a bios update to allow the card to work is slim to none, and the only place you might find anything would be the MSI support pages.


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## Kladmajster (Aug 19, 2014)

Hello guys,
so after quite the time spent on trying to fix my PC - where I had to return and refund bad manufacturer 570m card, trying to bake 3 times my old 570m card in the oven (which fixed it a little, but the shutdowns during games still procured) ... I finally ordered another card from eBay, this time 670m (which basically is the same thing as 570m, just with a bit higher clocks) as I couldn`t find a suitable replacement. It is around 2 years old also, but still working.

And I have to say, it works and these random shutdowns finally stopped and I am able to play games again, browse internet etc. without any fear of shutting down my system. Apparently that old 570m got fried a little from a small overclocking I sometimes applied through MSI afterburner and this caused some power/heating spikes inside the chip and thus trigging the failswitch shutdowns...

So for anyone using a "gaming" laptop ... always clean take care of cooling on your laptops and never apply any OCng as is significantly reduce the lifetime of your components...and if you happen to encounter something like me (and some others) and decide to order a replacement, be extra thorough on choosing the product, since laptop components are very delicate when it comes to the manufacturer and brand bios/vbios compatibilities.
I`ve learned it the hard way and lost over 100USD on return shipping and import charges of the bad (dell vbios) 570m from USA...and then I payed over 200 euros for the next 670m replacement.

cheers


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